IRC Chatlog irc-tls-07-13-2004.log

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[@Lamebot ] [ stock ] [ uteck ] [ pablo7 ] [ plunk ]

[ egibbs ] [ dsearls ] [ Curt ] [ init2null ] [ human ]

[ papercut ] [ mwg ] [ axiomnow ] [ KevDude ] [ Eggplant ]

[ Statman ] [ Arne ] [ linuxlobby] [ LinuxJones] [ zx80 ]

[ toga ] [ Kent ] [ segfault ] [ jose ] [ Galik ]

[ Voyager ] [ Berkz ] [ JeffGerhar] [ prl ] [ ric ]

[ jrzagar ] [ boneski ] [ warthawg ] [ isierra ] [ USSROVER ]

[ Newsome ] [ ct ] [ leje ] [ opus ] [ NZheretic ]

[ theedo ] [ GreyBeard ] [ Logger ] [ Bossman ] [ NigelS ]

[ danalien ]

Channel #linuxshow was created at Fri Apr 9 13:08:33 2004

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<stock> evening

<dsearls> RMS on the beach, in Tux mode;

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<LinuxJones> hi stock

[linuxlobbyist ] [LinuxJones ] [ ] [ ]

<stock> lo LinuxJones

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<Arne> Berkz - H.S. mathematics teacher

<stock> hi doc

<NigelS> papercut: heeh, there was a funny post (shock horror) on slashdot the

other day where someone made fun of the fact that two posters had

somehow managed to mention vi, emacs, star trek and star wards in

the same thread. That's got to be approaching some degree of

flaming critical mass :)

<segfault> where abouts in the world is doc tonight?

<papercut> dsearls: I wish I hadn't gone to that link. I'm eating!

<stock> dsearls doesn't look like a genuine all sunshine state :)

<papercut> NigelS: Hehe :-)

<dsearls> hey, all. running around here. trying not to answer my hotel door

naked. stuff like that.

<prl> dsearls, is that RMS's linuxbios fitted laptop?

<ric> too much info

<Statman> Come on Doc - no visuals like that - some of us have to sleep

tonight ;)

<NigelS> I second that ric :)

<Arne> **** We're BACK!!!

<theedo> coulda done without that mental image..I'm eating

<jrzagar> I'm confused, isn't this supposed to start at 8:00 CDT ?

<linuxlobbyist> dsearls: Now *that* was TMI

<toga> Voice!!!

<uteck> wife s demading attention, bye

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[bdbdbdb That's all Folks!]

<Eggplant> so they're not right on time at 8

<stock> prl huh? linux fits in da BIOS, no x86 bootrecord needed on your 2.5"


<opus> It's Jeff the GAME MASTER!

<Eggplant> Eric: put the guns up, man

<Galik> horey!

<Galik> is eric packing heat?

<egibbs> chatted with a linux user that has a camel --in CA

<Curt> Galik, that's his choice.

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<dsearls> who's got a camel? email me the info. linux journal needs trivia.

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<prl> stock>

<Arne> dsearls - Filtered or non-filtered

<Arne> hehehe

<opus> I smoke cigarettes made by the Cherokee Indians in Pryor, Oklahoma.

Does that count?

<theedo> beat me to it Arne..*LOL

<JeffGerhardt> heelo doc

<dsearls> i was waiting for that comeback...

<dsearls> Hey, j

<NZheretic> "Why keep a camel when you can hump yourself?"

<warthawg> opus, are you an okie?

<Eggplant> rrc?

<opus> Yes

<linuxlobbyist> Isn't there a 'camel' subsystem of sorts built into

Ximian[/Novell] Evolution?

<warthawg> i was up in indian territory 2 weeks ago

<toga> Oh, earthquake weather ;)

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<stock> MIT ? thats philidelphia?

<Eggplant> whose kids do I hear in the background?

<toga> ADTI staff

<Eggplant> weather in detroit has been nice

<dsearls> bummer. not getting sound. Are we on yet?

<Eggplant> we's on yes

<dsearls> k

<warthawg> dsearls, yep, its on

<theedo> I was in NC & Georgia 2 weeks ago..nothing but rain then too

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<Arne> Eggplant - what part of Detroit are you from?

<prl> dsearls, I'm getting sound fine here in Oxford

<stock> no weird noises

SignOff pablo7: #linuxshow (Ping timeout: 195 seconds)

<Eggplant> Arne: Warren, MI....

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<Eggplant> about 4 blocks north of 8 mile

<warthawg> opus: i have family near cache and indiahoma

<dsearls> got it now. cool.

<opus> I live in the booming community of Kansas, Oklahoma.

<mwg> Eggplant: I have a friend who lives in Roseville, he used to live at

13.5 and Schoenherr.

<Arne> Eggplant - Ah!! I know it well. I graduated from Cooley High (Fenkell

and Hubbell)

<Eggplant> mwg: no shit? I grew up 14 & Hayes, not more than a mile from

that location

<papercut> Eric.. eat the deep sea fish!! Is boneski here?

<dsearls> prl; we once ran a car off the road and over a fence at a roundabout

in oxford.

<Eggplant> Arne: cool. I'm a cousino reject here

<warthawg> opus: that's a long way from indiahoma

<mwg> Eggplant: I live in Southgate, but work at the Detroit water board.

<opus> Yes, it is.

<Eggplant> mwg: need a computer hacker? grin... I'm currently laid off,

trying to get *something* together here

<boneski> papercut, yeah. Just been outside, there's a big helicopter going

around in circles

<mwg> "The Final Virus": A new song by Europe? :-)

<warthawg> black helicopter?

<papercut> boneski: Hi! Men in black???

<Curt> That's "Freedom Fry"

<plunk> boneski: is it shining a spotlight on your house?

SignOff segfault: #linuxshow (Quit: segfault)

<mwg> Eggplant: Hiring freeze on at the moment. :-(

<cmcnabb> Boneski: You got a tin foil hat handy?

<Eggplant> mwg: C'est l'guerre

<boneski> indeed there is a spotlight, but it's a bit wavy

<egibbs> dsearls: Lady at this web site uses linux -

<NZheretic> I beat ESR by almost four years : Nov 2000 - Hybris : a demo for

the next generation of viruses


<papercut> boneski: Don't let 'em take you!

<toga> pee in it to theirs genes to it.

<Curt> French would be good in Quebec, too.

<prl> My audio feed (NY) just stopped.

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joined #linuxshow

<toga> s/add their/

<Eggplant> prl: going strong here

<Statman> NY feed is still going here prl

<asaone> Hello all

<boneski> should I turn out the lights?

<prl> Hm, OK again.

<stock> "Permis de grand public de gnu, bauche une"

<boneski> they come again...

<papercut> boneski: Yep :)

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<Severian> Is there anyone on here who can change the website?

stock loves :)

<Arne> Severian -- KevDude is your main

<Curt> I'm surprised that the FSF-France didn't do this first.

<Galik> true

<JeffGerhardt> yes it was a surprise that the FSF did not do it

<Galik> but it would have been nice for them to have collaborated as well

<Curt> Bloomberg is right on with this one.

<boneski> ...and again...

<JeffGerhardt> it is sometimes hard to collaborate with the FSF

<papercut> The FSF are too busy chasing down GNU/Linux transgressions..

<TomWitt> off topic but the quality of the feed is much better tonight...

minimal squealing

<Galik> lol

SignOff KevDude: #linuxshow (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.52B [Mozilla


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<papercut> Even the uname command has been changed to output GNU/Linux..

<Curt> Tom, I agree. ibiblio's feed is very clear

<dsearls> the sound is great here in london, where i'm getting it at 88.3 fm,

off the little transmitter plugged into the audio out on the laptop.

<Arne> TomWitt - We fed the pigs before the show this week..

<egibbs> is quality ever off topic?

<TomWitt> Arne- You should do that more often

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<Arne> lol

<boneski> ...and again...

<linuxlobbyist> For the first time since I can remember, I'm listening to an

OGG feed that's flawless

<papercut> boneski: you're still with us!

<boneski> yeah, reckon king kong must be on the loose or something

<Eggplant> for some reason, I chickened out on the ogg feed. not certain if

ogg will drop from mozilla to xmms

<mwg> linuxlobbyist: Neat, I'll try the oggs next week, then. I'd given up.

stock kudos to the sound team

<ROM> it will

<Eggplant> rom: this is good

<papercut> boneski: Remember that crack you made about wimpy little grey guys

when we were talking about aliens and deep sea fish?

<LinuxJones> night all work tomorrow

SignOff LinuxJones: #linuxshow (Quit: Leaving)

<Galik> I dragged the ogg link onto xmms from Mozilla

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<jrzagar> can someone post a link to the article that we're currently


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<ROM> I just double clicked

<dsearls> arne, please email me that quote, okay? i actually need it tonite.

<mwg> I just click on whatever (ogg, mp3, etc) and xmms goes off and does its


<stock> "Because the technology has become so complex that no single

organization can efficiently manage it. " <==== Yeah, they fired

all the techies :)

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<opus> I agree Arne!

<papercut> ROM: The epitath of Windows users..

<Severian> KevDude, there are two typos on the webpage. One is funny, but I

assume it is an error. controersy surounding->controversy

surrounding, inciteful->insightful

<opus> Windows is a good example!

<LinuxItch> phew! I'm glad I made it ... I had to re-install SuSE 9.1 and

x-chat in a panic.

<ROM> :)

<LinuxItch> how is everyone.

<papercut> Hi!

<Curt> I'm fabulous

<Arne> dsearls - I'll mail to doc@searls...

<egibbs> google search 1,870,000 for linux london

<Curt> There's a platform strategy?

<boneski> papercut, I saw that dark ugly one again recently. It was part of a

larger pic

<ROM> Bad for windows... fine for linux

<KevDude> severian, what was the second one?


<boneski> LinuxItch, have a gnoppix cd to hand

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<papercut> boneski: Excellent! Still got problems with your chopper? :-)

<LinuxItch> boneski: i have one but I wanted SuSE on my laptop. 'tis the best

<KevDude> found it...

<JZA> is the show on yet

<NZheretic> Jeff : Answer is "DESPERATION".

stock service pack SP2 for XP is delayed.... Longhorn is now for 2007 ...

ehh sorry 2008... did i hear 2011 ? Ok 2011 it is...

<Curt> JZA yes, alive and cooking

<Eggplant> jza: been on 20 min now

<opus> The service pack is delayed sir!

<papercut> NZheretic: 2011. Ten past eight? Wow that's not long..

<Galik> MS platform strategy: Is there more than one platform? yes-> kill of

one of them, no -> end; repeat

<opus> There may be no new windows past XP!

<JZA> oh

Eggplant/#linuxshow needs to check to see if my ntpd stopped... I've got

2121 EDST -0400 here

<LinuxItch> does anyone know if bitch-x is gui or command-line. I just

installed it and don't see a menu option in KDE.

<Eggplant> bitchx is commandline

<jrzagar> gaim works

<prl> No single organisation, etc -

<egibbs> bitchx is in lesbian linux:)

<Severian> KevDude, that message had both. the first was controersy

surounding. The second was inciteful.

<NigelS> LinuxItch: very much command line, irssi is better though :)

<Arne> dsearls - On it's way to you.

<dsearls> thanks, arne

<Eggplant> I'm abusing kvirc on mandrae

<Statman> I don't think that'll happen opus, but there is a big growing group

of people who are sick of virii, pop-ups, spyware, etc.

<opus> Use X-CHAT!

<Eggplant> mandrake, even

<ROM> there is also gtkbitchx

<warthawg> i have a funny story to tell on myself about bitch-x, but i will

never reveal it because it makes me looks so stupid.

<papercut> That's GNU/Lesbian Linux ;-)

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<toga> 60 and counting, yes the bot is counted too ;)

<ROM> which installed itself on my kde menu

<Severian> KevDude, or was inciteful an intentional play on words?

<Galik> xchat r0ckz0rz

stock imagines a Microsoft Certified .NET programmer in Redmond, browsing

some pages with IE6 : b00m , a new ghost session is due.... Do we

have a Redmond Munity of the Bounty ?

<warthawg> oh, what the hell. my stupidity is legendary. i thought i was

running bitch-x for six months, before i noticed one day that it

was xchat.


<KevDude> severian, have to ask jeff on that one :)

<Eggplant> warthawg: heh. Nice. I thought only *I* do shit like that

<warthawg> Eddplant :)

<Statman> LOL warthawg

<papercut> England.. near London

<stock> Mutiny even

<warthawg> Eggplant, too

<Eggplant> I read Eric's SF story this evening. What a gass

<LinuxItch> i agree - did anyone hear about Longhorn's possible integration

with it's Unix Services for Windows? They're basically admitting

that they NEED to play nice with *nix

<toga> Like big cities?

<Curt> Egg, what story?

<Statman> One month ago I wouldn't have thought the company I work for

would've considered Mozilla. Today I think there's at least a decent


<opus> You can also hear some pretty good Linux arguments on : 'The ARMED


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<ROM> Nah.... I think they just wanna do a SCO... "Longhorn is a better linux

than Linux"

<Eggplant> lemme find that, showed up on lwn via my sidebar on slashdot... heh

<toga> 61

<Eggplant> friggin' geek computer addict

SignOff boneski: #linuxshow (Quit: guru meditation)

<stock> OSS in EU government yes... FOSS support in major EU ICT corporations

? no

<papercut> Longhorn will be a Windows shell built on a Linux kernel and called


boneski2 is now known as boneski

<Galik> lol

<NZheretic> Microsoft's customers are asking : If Open Source/Linux is so bad,

why is IBM,Novell,Oracle,Sun,SGI,Cray getting behind it 100%?


<LinuxItch> I'm going to try bitch-x ....

SignOff LinuxItch: #linuxshow (Quit: Leaving)

<PhantomsDad> streams working?

<Curt> I worked in financial services in Tokyo for a few years. Linux was very

widely used, very quietly.

<opus> There would be no cruise missle had it not been for Linux.

<warthawg> papercut, that's not as unlikely as some might think

<boneski> using gaim here now...

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<warthawg> PhantomsDad, good real from texas

<egibbs> MS should just buy the distro that already looks like WinXP

<alan__> hey -- this is what text based irc is like. kinda neat

<papercut> warthawg: Yeah, worrying thought..

<ct> Is Novell getting behing OSS 100% ? I don't think so.

<Galik> opus: yes there would only it would have cost 10 times as much and

crash more often

<Curt> Thanks Egg, got it.

<Eggplant> gibbs: But Robertson (linspire's ceo) doesn't want Bill's money

--------------- -- -

| ct ( (Australia)

ircname : ct

| channels : #linuxshow

server : (The LINUX(R)Show!![tm])

: idle : 0 hours 0 mins 12 secs (signon: Wed Jul 14 01:59:31 2004)

<Eggplant> curt: np

<alan__> ct: IBM isn't even behind OSS 100%

<egibbs> I want voice based irc!

SignOff dsearls: #linuxshow (Quit: Snak 4.10 Unregistered copy. Evaluation

period is over. Program will now quit. Thanks for using Snak.)

<ROM> less than 100% is good enough

<stock> ct i wonder indeed... why you have doubts?

boneski is now known as poo

<opus> It's tuff to install Apache and Tomcat on AIX 5X. They want to sell


<alan__> nooo... doc got booted by a demo irc client

<Curt> eg, text is much better. It has perminance.

<Eggplant> egibbs: amen, bro

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<mwg> In my experience, updating packages withour trashing the system means

get source and stay away from package managers.

<Eggplant> voice to text irc

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<opus> Say goodnight to doc and his 'EVALUATION COPY'!

<Eggplant> and voice recognition that works

<ct> Is Red Hat getting behind OSS 100%? YES

<opus> HE HE HE HE HE!

<ROM> true

<papercut> boneski has been abducted

<ROM> but so waht

<NigelS> how embaressing :)

<boneski> hehe

<egibbs> Eggplant: fun - let op assign voices

<JZA> I need to know an article on ' How can I make my Government switch to


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<boneski> I'm his replacement. Bwahahahaha

<stock> from 30seconds to 0.03 secs respond time! Oracle on Linux ,


<alan__> what's the status of Paris? Is that official yet?

<Curt> JZA, you cannot force government to do anything. It's EVIL.

<jrzagar> Yes, but the AU financial district also quoted a 1000% preformance


<Eggplant> oh, it could still work. We just figure out code words to indicate

system commands, and voice normally

<ROM> stock, is that a real statistic?

<egibbs> Paris made a video

<NZheretic> Microsoft's customers are asking : If Open Source/Linux is so bad,

why is IBM,Novell,Oracle,Sun,SGI,Cray getting behind it 100%?

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joined #linuxshow

<vladster> Hey mmccune

papercut/#linuxshow prods gingerly at boneski

<JZA> Curt, yeah but I am in the belly of the beast already

<JZA> hi roblimo

<Curt> jr, that's 1200 TIMES, which is 120000%

<roblimo> How

<TomWitt> egibbs: Yes, she did

<stock> ROM if you ask the CFO to run his weekly query ? YES

<Eggplant> hey rob

<JZA> roblimo any news from the IBM people

<NZheretic> Hello roblimo.

<JeffGerhardt> doc is there a story you want me to slip in

<ROM> stock... very cool

boneski/#linuxshow metamorphosises into a big creapy thing

<Curt> roblimo, you were featured a few minutes ago.

<ROM> hey isn't Ken Brown supposed to show up?

<opus> JeffGerhardt : Doc's evaluation copy of his IRC chat expired and it

logged him off! GOOD BYE!

<NZheretic> Microsoft Longhorn Vs Linux Cowpuncher

<alan__> JeffGerhardt: doc was kicked off - his irc client was an evaluation


<JeffGerhardt> hey robin

<Joe> speaking of STOCKS...I think Redhat got beaten today for no reason

<vladster> where is scout

<Curt> Use of older equipment is VERY important to remind people of. Use

present hardware, no upgrade cost.

papercut/#linuxshow mutates into a deep sea creature and battle commences..

<warthawg> roblimo, howdy hi :)

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<alan__> who is talking right now? Is that brian profit?

<Severian> Joe, there was a reason. They restated earnings.

<ct> Open source is costing jobs. Imagine is SCO couldn't use the SAMBA

source in their software, they would actually have to employ some


<JeffGerhardt> yes

<JeffGerhardt> it was brian

SignOff mckyj57: #linuxshow (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.52B [Mozilla


<Joe> yeh but I don't think it's bad news

boneski/#linuxshow slashes left claw

<Eggplant> ct: if we get our way, SCO *won't* be able to use any OS stuff due

to their egregious GPL violations...

<Galik> linux uses spin_lock in :)

<alan__> JeffGerhardt: thanks - it sounded like him

<Statman> ct - I had to laugh at that myself. Everyone else chuckle at Gates

grasping at that straw?

<jrzagar> SOMEONE revoked SCO's license to use their software... I just can't

remember who...

<alan__> I disagree about that - I like 2 desktops

<TomWitt> Earthquakes starting Arne?

<Eggplant> nmap

<warthawg> rob is dead wrong about 2 desktops being a problem

<alan__> you don't develop for a desktop though - you develop for a GUI


<mwg> I've used 8 or 9 desktops myself. Personally, I think that if your

application is aware of your desktop, something is wrong.

papercut/#linuxshow screams in agony! (or something)

<Curt> Wart, I agree with you.

<stock> JeffGerhardt did brian write some books already? his own article's on

LT get more audience as his linked stories

<alan__> is brian a regular guest now?

<vladster> I got UT2004, UT, Q3 and Apt to work under red hat 9

alan__ is now known as LinuxItch

<Severian> Joe, it was slightly bad. And the market usually takes a downward

restatement as bad news. So, this was just as you should have

expected. If you are a RedHat believer, this might be a buying


<papercut> boneski: I'm going to creat a new distro GNU/DeepSeaFish

<Curt> Being able to develop for any "desktop" and have it work with any other

"desktop" is a highpoint, not a lowpoint.

<Arne> alan__ -- Brian is filling in for Doc

<Eggplant> vladster: have you written the HOWTO yet?

<JZA> the CFO ran away

<LinuxItch> I have to learn how to configure bitchx

<linuxlobbyist> Ouch, that was nasty. Stupid investors.

<Joe> I am a stock holder

<LinuxItch> Arne: thanks

<vladster> for the game setup ?

<ROM> Red Hat Drops and SCOX can't drop below $5. :p

<Eggplant> oh, and vladster: Scott??

<linuxlobbyist> It's *still* overpriced, though (nondisclaimer: I'm stock


<NigelS> papercut: don't confuse distribution with operating system

<ROM> yuk

<Arne> TomWitt - No earthquake -- wife blew a breaker

<Joe> buying yes....I hope so.

<Statman> Dee-bian? I always thought it was deb-ian

<LinuxItch> what's red hat at now? I bought novell a few months ago when it

was at $13 - now it's at $8 or so. uggh

<papercut> NigelS: It's not difficult to confuse me :)

<vladster> that is my name

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<cmcnabb> LinuxItch: I got into NOVL at 11.

<Eggplant> vladster: that the navy corpsman scott??

<Curt> Statman, agreed. Deborah and Ian.

<vladster> this could get confusing

<opus> It was surprising to see Progeny 2 considering they said they would

never do that.

<stock> hmm

SignOff PhantomsDa: #linuxshow (Remote host closed the connection)

<Arne> LinuxItch -- I use BitchX... It's difficult to config, but it's works

just like standard IRC, which helps.

<LinuxItch> cmcnabb: yeah, it sucks

<vladster> no , but I use to be in the Navy

<boneski> papercut, sounds better than the puppy one

<papercut> :)

<boneski> when does the fight start?

<Curt> Who hasn;t?

<Eggplant> too weird. I know another Scott in the Chicago area, former navy

corpsman, uses the vlad nick

<LinuxItch> Arne: thanks, I just installed it and it's my first time using. I

want to learn more command line apps like this.

<cmcnabb> vladster: I was in the Nav from 80 to 89 - "Submarine Nuclear

Electrical Operator -Supervisor" was the NEC.

<papercut> GNU/Spam

<ROM> Shoot spammers.... I like it

<mwg> Picking up the Slack? Does Pat V. know about that? :-)

<Statman> lol

<Eggplant> spammers suck!!!

<Galik> beans. egg, and spam

<warthawg> i was in the navy too, 63-70

<Statman> Not painful enough >:)

<Eggplant> I want to see Al Ral strung up and fucked with a giant dildo...

<LinuxItch> eric: brilliant!! :)

<Curt> Eric, I think this is already being tried.

<toga> ESR: The Final Virus: A Science-Fiction Story -

<vladster> I am not a zombie

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<ROM> Spammers die but the net gets completely clogged with stupid worms

<warthawg> hey, Valour

<papercut> Eggplant: Hey, I'm eating..

<Eggplant> heh

<Valour> warthawg: Howdy

<LinuxItch> you know - that's not that far fetched

<papercut> A sausage too..

<LinuxItch> I just found sassar on a client's machine today. terrible

<mwg> Well, you have put the idea out there, there is now almost NO chance

that someone will not try now.

<boneski> papercut, lol! I was thinking about bringing them up earlier today

<ROM> I know. But it would be killing the net to save it

<Newsome> how about a virus that rewrites the partition table, downloads Linux

, and reboots?

<vladster> spam eggs sausage and spam spam bacon and spam

<ROM> Newsome that would rock

<toga> ESR will be blamed!

<ROM> but eat up all the bandwidth

stock final-virus : Whats.For.Desert.a@MM

<papercut> boneski: heheh

<JZA> lol

<LinuxItch> Arne: hahahaha -- good one

<linuxlobbyist> Of course

<boneski> and then I started thinking about beans

<Galik> LOL

<Eggplant> heh

<LinuxItch> so does apple, and BSD and Unix

<warthawg> what is macintosh?

<init2null> he really shouldn't have picked a month, imho.

<ROM> a form of fruit

<boneski> warthawg, a flasher's tool

<Eggplant> warthawg: green apples

<toga> Yesterday Senator Orrin Hatch issued a statement that Final highlights

the need to make so-called "Digital Rights Management" hardware

mandatory on all new computers.

<mwg> Heck, there are Windows users with far more reason to release a

Windows-killer than even the most rabid Linux zealot.

<papercut> warthawg: The best interface ever created (rolls eyes..)

<cmcnabb> bah. legislation. It's time the politicians learn they work for the

people, not the corporations.

<NZheretic> MacOSX is at danger though holes in Microsoft's Office for Mac.

<LinuxItch> what about the DMCRA?

<Eggplant> I had to bitch my sister out again today. Caught her using

Internet Explorer against my explicit instructions not to. After

all the work I put into putting up Mozilla

<stock> hmmm

<Statman> When DRM becomes mandatory for big brother to protect me from myself

, sign me up for a black market PC...

<toga> tin hat time!

<cmcnabb> Ah. Conspiracy theory night. Just up my alley.

<Valour> Eggplant: disable IE and it won't be as much of a problem

<papercut> GNU/Paranoia

<Newsome> Knoppix.a@MM virus

<ROM> Keep your laws off of my computer

<opus> I believe that all future PC's pre-loaded with Windows should have a 4

year timer hooked to about 1 pound of plastic explosives! It should

be part of their manditory upgrade program.

<stock> tin-foil hat , the golden edition

<Arne> DRM == Digital Rights Management

SystemError [] has joined


<LinuxItch> I think the most paranoid situation is the final virus does NOT

get written and all the viruses leading up to the final virus are

written, but never the final one.

mwg/#linuxshow tries to remember if he ever had a tinfoil hat...

<Eggplant> Valour: provide me some instructions, man. it's a 98 machine

<warthawg> segment el dos!

<Arne> DRM == Digital Radio Mondale (also)

<pablo7> coast-to-coast conspiracies galore.

<NZheretic> 2000-09-27 : Alienation by antivirus industry fuels Virus creation

[Was: A crazy paranoid question for the group] ...


<Valour> Eggplant:


<Arne> ooops Mondale --> Mondiale

<warthawg> ok, i'

<Eggplant> valour: thanks!

<Galik> nice tune :)

<papercut> boneski: I've a present for you

<vladster> is there a reference of al the chatroom commands somewhere. I am

fumbling through like a blind rat.


<warthawg> m taking bets. i say esr will win by tko in 3rd round

<p0z3r> This reminds me a little of Paris Combo.

<Arne> Ken Brown is in the room.

SignOff mmccune: #linuxshow (Read error: Connection reset by peer)

<Galik> <')>>><

<egibbs> hosted by Art Bell

<p0z3r> I can't believe you guys have Ken Brown on here..

<ROM> oh man I wanna hear ken brown

<asaone> kick ass music

<papercut> Hi Ken -

<ROM> I need a laugh

<JZA> wow this show is going pretty good so far

<Eggplant> 'lo Ken

<Musashi> you can type /help to get a list or /help command to get specific


<LinuxItch> ROM: me too :)

<papercut> Lester Young. Very cool..

<stock> well it all would fit : "Ballmie!!! ALL of our windows versions cannot

keep up.. we need new TCPA/DRM Longhorn machines , besides HP/Dell

etc. all want to get a boost on their hardware sales"

<mwg> Thas' one *ugly* fish.

<JZA> Ball - me.. get it?

<uteck> vladster: has some


<Eggplant> I thought we were going to be respectful??

<asaone> <--is Ken but not the one you want

<papercut> Ken, the fish wants a word with you..

<Eggplant> though, secretly, I wonder if he's short, ugly and very nerdy?

<ROM> Eggplant, you are right

<Curt> Egg, he's likely quite normal on the outside.

<Eggplant> indeed

<Valour> He's bald, black, 35-ish

<Arne> **** We're BACK !!! with Segment 2 ******

<papercut> Nope. He's got pointy little horns.,.

<Eggplant> rofl

<Valour> There was a photo of him somewhere on the net a while back

<mwg> The fish has a word, and the word is *CHOMP*

<ROM> But honestly I think he will make himself look bad

<Curt> Arne, that wasn't an extra long break... Hmmm....

<Galik> i don't think u need a final virus. At current (exponential) rate of

viri increase you could prolly plot the end of the world on a piece

of graph paper

<JZA> hehe

<vladster> were Bach

<plunk> Did any of you folks hear the results of the USS Hartford grounding

incident investigation? It turns out the Voyage Management System

computers crashed and couldn't be rebooted, causing the navigation

team to panic.

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<mwg> Tuesday the 13th?.......naaaah!

<uteck> The MS final virus is called Longhorn.

<Curt> Plunk, what OS do they run on?

<ROM> what OS did hardford nav run?

<JZA> Tocsville?

<plunk> It appears to be windows NT

<Eggplant> Tokesville

<ROM> A little bit of a controversy....


<plunk> It's the navy's "Smart Ship" system

<NigelS> :D

<mwg> Toqueville, I think.

<Arne> Tocqueville

<Eggplant> now, where's that little bag of green I've got around here?

<JZA> the one that said that said that mini mouse invented Linux

<papercut> mwg: Heh. Closely followed by regurgitation..

<stock> The Alexis Toxic Ville inst. ?

<Eggplant> Alexis de Toqueville Institue

<Curt> Plunk, that's not "smart".

<Eggplant> without the missing T

<plunk> The USS Yorktown had a somewhat similar incident.

<stock> Eggplant thnks

<boneski> papercut, pity it's only 6" long. Needs to get to 6m!

<ROM> wow he is loud

<papercut> boneski: Hey, nothing wrong with 6" :-)

<cmcnabb> plunk: The exact reason Rickover made us in the Nuclear Field use

old tech, such as Magnetic Amplifiers, etc.

<LinuxItch> yikes

<Curt> Yeah, I'd heard that a ship running NT had had a BSOD incident a few

years ago, thought they would stop using it.

<boneski> papercut,

<stock> Curt it was a sub-marine atcually : it sank

<Curt> cmc, low tech WORKS, every time, reliably.

<theedo> kiss ass

<NZheretic> Be VERY carefull what you say. Mr Brown is likely to missquote


<papercut> boneski: There goes my deadline..

<ROM> low tech can be fixed too

<plunk> They seem to be still using winNT on the navy's ships. The VMS is

supplied by Sperry Marine

<warthawg> hehehe

<prl> Well, low tech tends to fail in fixable ways.

<init2null> i propose we insult him in rot13. just joking. ;)

<Arne> Alexis de Tocqueville Institute is considered to be a "right wing think


<boneski> init2null, rot26 better

<NigelS> boneski: :P

<papercut> Ask Mr. Brown about deep sea creatures.. we need to know..

<cmcnabb> stock: Which sub? The only US subs to sink in recent times were

the Thresher (1962 or 3) and the Scorpion (1967). Both long before


<mmccune> Arne: I thought they were supposed to be liberatarian?

<stock> plunk Curt you have a link to that NT BSOD incident on that Navy

sub-marine ?

<Galik> use rot?? <-- security through obscurity :)

<theedo> dedicated to lining our own pockets

--------------- -- -

| cmcnabb ( (Internic Network)

ircname : New Now Know How

| channels : #linuxshow

server : (The LINUX(R)Show!![tm])

: idle : 0 hours 0 mins 32 secs (signon: Wed Jul 14 03:00:20 2004)

<Eggplant> From what I've read of the late Mr. de Tocqueville, I believe he

would be rolling in his grave after reading Samizdat

<plunk> The USS Hartford didn't sink, it grounded off Sardinia, and was

repaired recently in (i think) Virginia.

<Arne> Well, they gave the AdT Award in 2001 to Richard Armey for his tireless

advocacy of school vouchers.

<papercut> I found the name for the previous fish it's here:

<plunk> A few years ago, the USS Yorktown, an aircraft carrier, went dead in

the water after its VMS tried to divide by zero.

<cmcnabb> I don't believe the 688 class subs run NT either, unless they've had

some changes since I got out.

<stock> cmcnabb look have read USENET for several years now, i i remember

clearly several postings about this.... i recently started to google

for em : all of em are vanished

<mwg> Did I just hear a sonar ping?

<cmcnabb> stock: Oh yeah. I believe EVERYTHING I hear on Usenet!

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<papercut> mwg: :)

<LinuxItch> huh!?!?!?

<LinuxItch> did I hear him right? PRO-open source?

<Eggplant> cmcnabb: so, have you sent the usenet article and $5 to all 6

people listed?

<stock> cmcnabb well ok its just USENET, why would they then even remove

USENET gossip postings about that sunken Navy sub-marine

<init2null> maybe caldera threw him a few cents once. :)



<stock> ?

<mwg> papercut: I was actually serious, I heard a noise that sounded rather

like a movie-style sonar ping.

<Galik> interviewed?

<NZheretic> "The ADTI paper makes many errors and draws unwarranted

conclusions. Ill just note a few examples of the papers

problems that arent as widely noted elsewhere: incorrect or

incomplete quotations, rewriting web browser history, and cleverly

omitting the most important data in one of their charts:"

<papercut> mwg: The sea is never far away

<ROM> So samizat was chosen because it's what people called the old UNIX code

and manuals?

<papercut> Fight! Fight! (Come on I want to see blood, or at least hear it).

Hit him Eric

<Eggplant> mwg: you need another beer, man

<boneski> sound is really clipping here

<Statman> lol

<ROM> the implication being then that linux stole from this stuff

<ROM> ?

<LinuxItch> papercut: ROFL!

<JZA> is he asking for forgiveness?

<JZA> or is just me

<NigelS> link to "Opening the Open Source Debate" -->

mwg/#linuxshow thinks maybe the web site he went to is maiing a noise that

he didn't realize came from there.

<Arne> NZheretic - That's David Wheeler's paper. He writes good stuff.

<roblimo> I refused to answer Ken's email on license-dicuss

<LinuxItch> papercut: I heard a tone of Beavis in your voice

<NigelS> critique of "Opening the Open Source Debate" -->



<papercut> LinuxItch: :)

<Eggplant> insecure??? hah!!

<stock> Linus Torvalds stole the Minix code! ... ehh ?

<ROM> Open source is not less secure if you patch

<leje> I thought Kirkoff's Law was about current into a node equalling current


<plunk> Stock: There was a big article on it in the New London Day Newspaper.

Trouble is, you need to register to read it.

<NZheretic> ADTI quoted" David Wheeler several times in the paper, but in

some cases claims he said something he never said.

<JeffGerhardt> I am letting him talk so that he shows how little he knows

<cmcnabb> leje: Yeah.

<cmcnabb> That's the one I learned.

<LinuxItch> leje: sh*t that's right -- i remember that from high school

physics!! wow!!! long time ago :)

<roblimo> Never forget: AdTDI is the group for which the phrase "junk science"

was coined!

<jose> He expresses himself very poorly.

<papercut> Is Mr. Brown's voice 'masked'? Sounds like someone aononymous on a

news item..

<prl> The current one is Kirchoff's law, see the link for Kerckhoff's

<leje> That can't be what they were asking though ... is it?

<stock> plunk hmm New London Day Newspaper ? about that navy sub which sank ?

<Severian> prl, that pointer just says the wikipedia has no information on the


<papercut> er anonymous

<JeffGerhardt> rom, I prefer "no science"

<boneski> yeah, get on with it!

<plunk> The article in The Day doesn't mention windows NT, but it does mention

the VMS.

<ROM> JG: yup

<Eggplant> illegally???

<stock> plunk VMS stands for ?

<cmcnabb> True - source code does not MEAN securtiy, but it gives us the

chance to CHECK\ the security.

<Valour> So Brown admits that he is not an expert on the subject... if this is

true, what qualifies him to write a book on OSS?

<boneski> photo copied?

<mwg> Code irrelevant? Are we back to the Borg here?

<boneski> man this man knows fsck all

<roblimo> JeffGerhardt, these are the people who did the "second-hand smoke is

good for you" studies.

<Galik> The point is that source code is not a great deal more open that

decompiled code

<NigelS> I guess people phot-copied the domains on their harddisks :)

<Eggplant> no one's copying anything illegally. This open source. It can be

copied freely

<ROM> It seems that Brown doens't understand software as an evolving,

NON_STATIC process

<plunk> Voyage Management System. It's a program or set of them that the

ship's navigation team uses to plot the course, etc.

<prl> Sorry, cut'n'paste the URL, the single quote confused gaim

<JeffGerhardt> valour you are getting the ida

<JeffGerhardt> but just wait

<roblimo> JeffGerhardt, ask him about AdTI's tobacco industry advocacy and

papers claiming industrial waste is not harmful

<vladster> hey mmccune, is anyone going to be at the next festy?

<papercut> Brown is a flake. Next..

<ROM> ESR is educating him now

<roblimo> papercut, and a paid advocate.

<LinuxItch> security through obscurity doesn't work

<plunk> Isn't AdTI funded by Philip Morris?

<Eggplant> praise "bob"!

<papercut> roblimo: heh..

<roblimo> plunk, has been, yes. And Olin Foundation

<Arne> plunk - and M$

<roblimo> I tore these guys up what? Two years ago.

<Eggplant> keys. don't have the key? yer not drivin' the car

<mmccune> Vladster: There are always a few people there although summer

attendance is usually light.

<Arne> plunk - among others...

<ROM> The point is that if you have a changing updated system the source code

doesn't compromise security

<Eggplant> schnier

<ROM> If you don't patch, open source might hose you

<NigelS> "what I've been able to see" <-- I see the flaw already

<papercut> Why is this guy being given 'airtime'. I want deep sea fish

<TomWitt> "Argumentation?"

<jose> He's in a Think Tank? He sounds like a stree hustler!

<vladster> can spare an old ATX case so I can use my guts to play with sarge

<papercut> I'm not buying drugs of this guy!

<boneski> what a moron

<Eggplant> Arne: ask him if he knows a good $20 hooker

<Curt> ooOOOoooo! Terrorism!

<roblimo> jose, pay me to do studies for you...

<plunk> Link to New London Day newspaper:

<uteck> I bet Ken feels that his car is safe, but the source for his door lock

designe is open.

<LinuxItch> Eggplant: ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

<roblimo> Eggplant, Ken is more into $300 callgrils.

<jose> Calm down, rob

<toga> His point isn't defendable.

<ROM> You can't patch your car easily

<opus> Interesting.

<boneski> roblimo, girls or boys?

<Eggplant> rob: you sure?

<roblimo> Eggplant, yes.

stock Ohh look Hoomer look what i just found? what is it Marge ? it says

"Windows NT Source Code, (c) Microsoft", Oh cool Marge less put it

in my drawer now... Geez I now have M$ IP in my desk, I'm rich!

filty rich! "

<linuxlobbyist> This is actually going how I expected.

<Eggplant> yeah, after pimpin' for a while

<roblimo> I've met him and his cohorts.

<papercut> More dirt! This is good.

<egibbs> I patch my car all the time

<mwg> Semantic gymnastics, anyone?


<prl> No, get really EVIL people to review your code!

<egibbs> old tires

<toga> Who peers

<LinuxItch> Pimpin' ain't easy!

<toga> Who are peers

<linuxlobbyist> You don't get choose your peers, professionally speaking

<prl> They're GOOD at finding the holes!

<ROM> rofl eggplt

<papercut> Come on Linux people no more Mr. Nice Guy..

<jose> He's double-talking.

<uteck> If open code is so insecure, were are all the Linux worms?

<opus> It's an utter fact that closed source software such as Windows has

represented the greatest threat to Internet security in the last 10


<boneski> get back to your beeeeches brown

<papercut> Eggplant: lol

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toga/#linuxshow updated wikipedia 2 days ago ;)

<ROM> uteck: there was one....

<roblimo> JeffGerhardt, ask him how much he'd charge to start being a Linux


<opus> I still remember when code red - shut the internet completely down.

<papercut> Go Arne!

<prl> I've tried submitting to the kernel. It's hard. I failed.

<Curt> The problem is that Mr. Brown is being treated as a peer, when he is

actually a 1st year student.

<roblimo> Arne, get a quote from him! :)

<uteck> OMG 1 Linux virus, Ken is right!

<LinuxItch> I hope ken didn't think that he'd be able to promote his book or

something. this ain't the right place

<ROM> exactly

<ROM> but...

<Eggplant> those 15-y/o's could code the fuck outta Ken here

<ROM> the worm was for an old bug in apache

<NigelS> lol, it'd be funny if he pitched it :)

<ROM> that was patched a looong time before

<opus> "I love you"

<roblimo> LinuxItch, buy *my* book! Point and Click Linux! Coming in November!

<vladster> it takes a 15 yearold hacker to trap a 15 yearold cracker

<JZA> cool

<Eggplant> vlad: and they've both got the attitude and personality of


<LinuxItch> roblimo: I'll certainly do that!

<mmccune> Beat him up Arne!

<ROM> It's back to the point... if you have a living non static system you

will have better security

<stock> basicly the same holds for Intellectual Property of Physics Research:

should a physisist publish _his_ IP in the "Physical Review" journal


<jose> Fan? It is lining his pockets with MS money

<Eggplant> oh, the issue: if you have the opportunity to better


<papercut> roblimo: lol

<JZA> is it me or he sound like the Microsoft guy that talks on their


<Eggplant> blah blah blah

<uteck> Name what programs you use Ken. Prove your statment.

<NigelS> what a load of waffle

<prl> I'm so glad I stayed up for this

<vladster> no kidding, that is why they are socially disfunctional with their


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<toga> He related to Daren?

<nyet> holy crap what a ftard

<JZA> He sound like the guy who talks on the Microsoft Infomertials at TechTV.

<ROM> Oh here we go now

<nyet> this guy is beyond stupid

<boneski> man, how to tenenbuam put up with this idiot?

<opus> Since OBL doesn't even trust cell phones, why in the crap are we

worried about what he knows about open source? There are camel nuts

with more intelligence than OBL.

<ROM> Anti-american communism

<jose> roblimo> I wish your book were out now. I love Mepis

<Curt> Watch out! MS FUD!

<nyet> on a scale from 0 to 10, hes -10e3

<linuxlobbyist> He's avoiding ALL the questions he's being asked

<Curt> "Commercial leverage"?????

<LinuxItch> imagine his words coming from ballmer's mouth

<nyet> hes a big fan of R&D

<prl> I'll be going to sleep confident that FLOSS is not under serious threat.


<opus> We're being spinned here!

<Curt> The man is a fascist.

<Eggplant> linuxitch: and you wonder who put them there?

<papercut> Is this the next US president?

<NigelS> the objective of OS was not to produce "low cost software" it was to

free software; he's thinking purely in economics and dubious

economics at that. What aboutt he moral argument, the freedom as in


<ct> Now he's showing his true colors

<ROM> Who said it best.... was it ESR "Linux is complete and infinite free


<mmccune> JZA: He sounds like a politician!

<boneski> yeah, what are you trying to say?

<Eggplant> ask him where the WMD's are next

<pablo7> open source != communism

<ROM> ?

<stock> from 1900 until today, scientists published their findings in

scientific journals, did it cause a major brakedown for Industries

using Applied Physics tech ?

<mwg> Like Linus doesn't have some incentive to develop technology?

<LinuxItch> Eggplant: i don't wonder that any more

<roblimo> JeffGerhardt, "If proprietary software is better than open source,

why does run on FreeBSD?"

<NZheretic> Mr Brown has not answered the question that was asked.

<NigelS> the lower cost is a side-effect

<Newsome> What about the fact that FLOSS isn't necessarily written by


<toga> And R&D shouldn't be given exclusively to private enterprise at tax

payer expense.

<roblimo> (Used to run on Linux, BTW)

<Eggplant> it's eric!

<Eggplant> fuck

<stock> or Applied Science ?

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<cmcnabb> Can someone ask Ken if he thinks that taxpayer sponsored research

(such as the ones he just mentioned) should be owned by the


<Eggplant> explain to him the idea behind Copyleft

<prl> The "intellectual Property" idea has effectively confused Copyright,

Patents, etc. He doesn't get it.

<mmccune> Open Source != Public Domain

<LinuxItch> absolutel f*cking clueless

<Eggplant> and how does one entity control work that belongs to the


<jrzagar> Government-funded R&D is paid for with public money.

<Eggplant> Linuxitch: clue-resistance field generator in high gear here, too

<plunk> Stock: Here's what to look for at the New London Day: Report Details

<ROM> Caldera gpl'd GEM

<JeffM> give the money a peanut!

<JZA> is he stoned?

<mwg> THe only real pressure is that people who don't like non-GPL don't use

non-GPL. It is pressure if you feel it is, but that's it.

<JeffM> give the monkey a peanut!

<nyet> "im just an observer, i just observe people saying stupid things, so im

just reporting them"

<jose> DC, so he is a Street Hustler!

<pablo7> political pressure doesn't apply to people with principles.

<vladster> How come he sounds like a Redneck

<toga> Folks???

<LinuxItch> this is the 'wrestlemania' episode of TLS

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<toga> Balmer?

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<NigelS> what a load of rubbish

<NZheretic> Ken : THose people, Do they work for Microsoft?

<mmccune> JZA: He sounds like Spicoli on Fast Times at Ridgemont High!

<pben> sounds like duba's iraq advisor

<JeffM> why did they have this guest on? He knows nothing!

<opus> He sounds like Arne. Maybe from Michigan.

<Curt> Now he calls it an opinion.


<papercut> ROM: Yes

<Eggplant> yeah, we michiganders sound *special*

<prl> So use another license, Ken?

<NigelS> he stood up and didn't say "I don't think the GPL is great" he stood

up and said "Linus didn't right Linux" flame flame flame

<nyet> "i dont agree with anything im saying, im just an observer"

<init2null> that sounds like sco there. "the silent majority"

<stock> plunk : VMS : "But almost immediately the ship's Voyage Management

System froze up" google cache

<vladster> Is he looking at this chat channel

<roblimo> I find Ken amusing. I enjoy him.

<Arne> opus - I dunno about that.

<Eggplant> okay, ask him who authored Linux?

<Eggplant> rob: same same. he is just ignorant of *all* the issues.

NigelS/#linuxshow thinks Ken should apply for a job on Fox News

<jose> He is lying. Just about every none GPL app has a mailing list. I am on

several. I have never seen any pressure.

<nyet> ken, people who like OSS voluntarily use the GPL, with FULL knowledge

of what it means

<LinuxItch> who would force someone to do that? who has the power to do that

<Galik> SUN + java :>

<NZheretic> Backpedal.

<NigelS> this is a bizzare bizzare tanjent

<JZA> Java

<roblimo> Arne, ask him about Microsoft's PR people disavowing him as an

embarassment. (True)

<Galik> we need to force them to use GPL hehe

<mwg> True,he said pressure,. not force.

<JZA> true

<nyet> people intentioally avoid the BSD when they can, ken

<Eggplant> pressure?

<Eggplant> how?

<pablo7> back sliding???

<egibbs> would be difficult to pressure ESR to do anything!

<boneski> yeah, I go round to their houses threatening them

<Ranger> Names Ken, Names.. Any Names?

<JZA> Sun has been pressure to GPL JAVA

<toga> People get aggressive when you call them liars!

<NigelS> "unusual amount of prssure" does imply forced through "intimidation"

which isa word he used

<plunk> Stock: thanks. that's the article I read.

<JeffM> whooooorrrrp! Boom!!!!

<papercut> The Three Stooges, and we've only got one of them..

<jose> Jeff, about the only one that I can think of is kapital, by the

kompany. Reason? They charged folks for a product and have never

<opus> Tonight, 'Adolf Hitler' and his new book! What does he think about the

Israelie security fence?

<nyet> "pressure" meaning "coders like publishing their code under the GPL"

<NigelS> nonsense

<jose> developed anything worthwhile

<NZheretic> 1984 : GPL

<toga> SO were shackle around for a long time.

<Eggplant> that's force??

<ROM> When do we get to talk about his accusations about Linux?

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<JeffM> good one nyet

<Valour> Someone ask this ass clown WHY we should value his opinion over those

of the experts?

<toga> s/shackles/

<NigelS> the GPL is a classic license these modern EULA's are the "new"


<opus> The point is gentlemen, he has a point on the top of his head.

<mwg> Again, the only pressue is people not using non-GPL software if they

don't approve. Basic choice.

<NZheretic> 1991 : Current GPL lisence version.

<init2null> what others?

<nyet> no ken, they haven't

<Eggplant> time to find the answer to that trivia

<JZA> I think GPL is older than Microsoft Licence

<Eggplant> when was the gpl created?

<init2null> bsd & mit. that's about it.

<opus> This guy is an ignorant screwup.

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<mmccune> NZheretic: 1984 like the George Orwell book.

<ROM> Then why does Ken want to call GPL "hybrid source?"

<JZA> did he mean Open Source or Linux?

<nyet> GPL predates every MS license

<NigelS> well, maybe Stallman :P

<nyet> definitely


<boneski> squeeek!

<papercut> I like Mr. Brown's large red floppy feet. And his cool red nose

<egibbs> unworthy adversary

<Galik> give ers a valium

<nyet> "im jsut reporting them"

<ROM> He specifically says GPL is NOT open source

<LinuxItch> Will jerry springer be on next week?

<pablo7> don't try to put new FUD onto old licenses.

<roblimo> "Ken, if you don't like the GPL, don't use it for *your* software."

End. :)

peragrin [] has joined


<papercut> Shoot Eric!

<nyet> "i disagree with myself"

<Eggplant> articulate Ballmer & Gate's opinions

<vladster> he does not sound articulate

<boneski> nyet, rofl

<opus> I'm holding a gun to all your's heads! USE THE GPL OR ELSE!!!


<toga> Ken think the louder he is, the more correct he is :(

<LinuxItch> sounds EXACTLY like a gates/ballmer puppet

<opus> Eric's going to get him to cry next.

<NigelS> "I definitely agree that what I just said is ridiculous"

<Eggplant> GPL your software or the dog gets it!!

<Eggplant> damn!!

<NZheretic> The GPL is adopted by so many BECAUSE it has some inherent


<linuxlobbyist> Ah! So it's his OPINION, not his RESEARCH

<papercut> Ballmer and Brown on Pop Idol

<uteck> Nothing to see here people, move along.

<mmccune> Eggplant: This is really Ballmer with a voice modulator!

<JeffM> G oEric!!!

SignOff Curt: #linuxshow (Ping timeout: 195 seconds)

<jdr> What Ken B. is tiptoeing around is that software developers cannot

freely use GPL'd code without GPL'ing the derived project.

<toga> But I wrote Linux!

<peragrin> NZheretic: exactly

<jose> He is an idiot. Eric has already stated that there are many licenses.

Ken doesn't want to listen

<prl> People have lovely handwaving arguments about licenses and other stuff

on lists. I can quite imagine that he'd mistake this for pressure if

he didn't know the community.

<papercut> mmccune: lol. You're right!

<nyet> ok i take it back, this is not a waste of time

<nyet> this is wonderfully fun

<ROM> JDR, they can if they don't distribute it

<NigelS> well jose his point is nonsense

<roblimo> Ah. A real question!

<peragrin> JDr of course you can't use someone else's work without permission

<NZheretic> IBM,Novell,Oracle,Sun,SGI,Cray is releasing losts of software

under the GPL license.


<mwg> Pointed, or pointy? :-)

<LinuxItch> Trans-sexual midget hackers and their GPL-hating b*tches ... next

on the ken brown show

<Curt-> He Lies

<pablo7> ken "i have an opinion that everyone else is entitled to" brown

<jdr> ROM, yes- but they cannot distribute it to customers.

<papercut> roblimo: :)

<LinuxItch> sorry for the cursing

<ROM> I can use GPL stuff and modify the hell out of it as long as I use it


<Eggplant> linuxitch: new keyboard please

<LinuxItch> kill *which* bill

<JeffM> Good One LinuxItch

<mwg> The Uma Thurman model of development?

<jose> IBM hasn't made any money?

<NigelS> IBM sell linux servers

<ROM> and not release the new code

<prl> Ain't no-one else but IBM flogging shares on zSeries

<NigelS> how can he say that does not make money?

<egibbs> LinuxItch: it would be next big show

<Curt-> IBM states they have already made back their investment in less than

one year.

<Arne> kill Bill Gates

<LinuxItch> ibm sells iron, services, consulting, middleware,

<roblimo> Gawd, I could do this interview so much better...

<nyet> and services and support and integration, consulting

<NZheretic> They sell services around Linux!

<nyet> etc etc etc

<ROM> Here we go again

<LinuxItch> oh bullshit

<init2null> how is the gpl "mafia" any less harmful than the ms monopoly?

<NZheretic> BULLSHIT!

<Arne> roblimo - call in

<nyet> solutions provider, not a leech like MS

<ROM> Profit is in BIG IRON


<Eggplant> profit

<toga> Profit is in the services!!!

<Eggplant> it's all about profit

<NigelS> lol

<NigelS> lol

<Ranger> New hardware sales include profit.

<papercut> Gentleman, this is bollocks

<boneski> fsck me, this twat is unbelievable

<ROM> Step 1 collect underwear

<NigelS> != IBM :D

<Ranger> Service and support is a profit

<LinuxItch> profits are derived from revenues - after costs. am i wrong?

<Eggplant> anyone ever hear of ALTRUISM??

<nyet> SCOSource is making a PROFIT!

<roblimo> Arne, too many voices already. Sure you want mine?

<LinuxItch> red hat is doing fine.

<Curt-> New hardware and support=$$$

<opus> how is the gpl "mafia" any less harmful than the ms monopoly? - Are you

really that stupid?

<ROM> Step 2 ???

<Eggplant> doing good things because they are GOOD??

<NigelS> oh dear, this is too good. a vs IBM comparison

<JeffM> Kick the moron off! Kick the moron off!

<Curt-> Go Brian!

<jose> Oh lord, he can't see it so he doesn't believe it

<egibbs> ROM: only clean underwear

<init2null> that is just low to bring up rh's stock drop.

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<papercut> Hit him Brian!

<LinuxItch> roblimo: you gotta call in

<ROM> step 3 profit

<mmccune> MS stock is selling at the same price as it was in early 1998.

<papercut> what LinuxItch said..

<pablo7> what about puting service profits into capital or R&D?

<toga> Profit is in the services!!!

<TomWitt> Hey! He's the guy buying & propping SCO stock... I'm sure of it!

<mwg> What references does Mr. Brown use for there being no profit?

<peragrin> opus: simple the GPL mafia doesn't control you, it controls what

you do with it's source

<rasputin> goodnight everyone

<linuxlobbyist> Careful, guys, though. RHAT is still overpriced

<nyet> f profits, OSS is added value to developers

<opus> NO NO NO NO little man! NO NO NO NO.. You little oinker... Sounds

like a Clint Eastwood movie. HA!

<linuxlobbyist> But they ARE profitable

<ROM> I need dinner

<Eggplant> ahhh... brown expects that IBM is going to be INSTANTLY profitable

on a new venture

<jeremy_lq> everyone??

<ROM> can I get dinner from Brown too?

<TomWitt> MMMM... dinner on Ken Brown

<uteck> Quick what is IBMs stock at.

<TomWitt> I'm in for that

<mwg> I'll have spaghetti parmesan.

<Eggplant> hmmm...

<prl> I'll have a California burger,, Ken

<pablo7> i'm ordering steak.

<Eggplant> seoul garden, here I come!

<opus> peragrin - The point is you don't have to use the GPL license.

<toga> Steak!!!

<LinuxItch> i'll fucking read the damn financial statements myself. (i'm in a

corporate finance 101 course)

<asaone> going to have steak

<Curt-> There is no Thai food in North Carolina.

<linuxlobbyist> So Ken Brown knows more than IBM about their finances

<mmccune> Have hime take me to Chops in Chicago!

<Eggplant> for you detroiters, 15 & Dequindre, northeast corner, little korean

place, excellent food

<nyet> OSS saves developers millions of man hours

<opus> You are not required by LAW to use the GPL license peragrin.

<jrzagar> ATTENTION: RedHat is profitable!!! I'd like a 16-oz new york strip

<Galik> w00t :)

<init2null> do we get fed too?

<pablo7> somebody send ken a copy of the irc log too.

<asaone> the irc too ken

<papercut> That's a BIG dinner table

<jose> A street Hustler buy dinner? Mickey Dees..

<boneski> anal-ist more like

<nyet> MIT analysts?

<Ranger> IBM stated it publlicly iat their stockholders meeting that their

Linux business is generating a profit!

<Galik> can u send us all luncheon vouchers in there too?

<toga> Ohhhhhh!!! anal(ists)... clue


MacBeach [] has joined


<NigelS> "IBM has to increase this revenue stream, which now accounts for 60%

of the companys profits and has become what separates IBM from its

rivals such as Compaq Computer cpq (nyse: cpq - news - people) and

Sun Microsystems sunw (nasd: sunw - news - people). By pitching its

services, IBM manages to sell more hardware. Linux is yet another

part of the new IBM strategy."

<papercut> boneski: :)

<LinuxItch> yes - and they know that. to munich, and ibm - it will pay off in

the long run. they're not stupid

<NZheretic> Novell Attributes Profit to SuSE, Open Source Momentum

<nyet> he did a deep dive into ibm's source

<ROM> I'll even go for McDonalds

<linuxlobbyist> He has to buy EVERYBODY in IRC dinner

<Galik> Nice to be eating on Microsofts money :)

<NigelS> <-- IBM linux revenue

<Eggplant> so they're snatching accounts from microsoft.... oh, poor, poor


<JeffM> Get off the crack pal!

<linuxlobbyist> A lot smarter then this cracker

<Curt-> That's the point, he doesn't know what we're reading.

<papercut> I want the drugs this guy is on

<LinuxItch> IBM did provide services and 'hand holding' to munich for free

<mwg> <Burp!>

<nyet> he should ask for AIX/Dynix source in discovery

<Eggplant> welcome back to the land of competition

<toga> This is a snake oil sales guy.

<fred> I did a google serch on linux ibm profit, lots of hits

<JZA> what happened with the clause that found the guy that actually did the

reasearch for the Tocsville and said Linus DID the

<NZheretic> I can point to 100s of news articles.

<Eggplant> oh, no, the monopoly is gone


<mwg> Mr. Brown: WHat do you reference for RH profitibility?

<opus> You have a choice between the GPL or BSD license in as much as you have

a choice between Linux and say, FreeBSD... And in that reguard, I

run Linux.

<ric> redhat not profit?

<Eggplant> next week, man,I'll be here

<Curt-> Has Microsoft ever issued a dividend???


<Eggplant> bring this guy back next week

<vladster> thank god for top

<ROM> Bring this guy back every week

<mwg> He is offering to verify, take him up on it.

<Ranger> Make sure you get a rep from IBM on the line as well!!!

<LinuxItch> yes - bring him back next week for sure.

<linuxlobbyist> Dear Lord. This is a happy day. If THIS is the president of

AdTI, we have ZIP to worry about.

<nyet> red herring

<JeffM> roast him alive. roast him alove!!!

<pablo7> next time? i want dinner now.

<boneski> Curt-, yes, a year or so ago they started I believe

<JeffM> hee

<NZheretic> ASK KEN : WHO is saying that linux is not profitable , who is your


<init2null> let's make him a regular panelist. we need a guest troll on this

show. :)

<NigelS> "Red Hat has posted $10.7M profit amid a 53% increase in sales.

<prl> MS - yes a very small dividend, after much pressure

<Eggplant> this boy's about as sharp as a sack of wet mice

<ROM> Man I wish PJ from GrokLaw was here

<Curt-> THanks. About bloody time.

<NigelS> "Red Hat continues to enjoy its reign in the corporate GNU/Linux

world and has posted more than $10 million in profit report. With 98

,000 enterprise subscriptions signed last quarter, the company's CEO

couldn't be more happy with where the business is heading. Although

Red Hat has decided to end the product line for home users, they

didn't entirely abandon the community and have set up the Fedora

Project to carry out the task of providing a free GNU/Linux distrib

<TomWitt> I don't want to have Ken Brown for dinner. I want Ken Brown to BUY

me dinner.

<vladster> I accidently started two instance of QuakeIII , switch to a console

to kill them

<LinuxItch> careful brian - there is a good answer to that in terms of harm

<NZheretic> Backpedal.

<nyet> OSS is added value to EVERY developer and company that uses it to build


<opus> This guy has a reputation lower than snakes piss.

<boneski> He can buy me dinner providing he's not there

<Ranger> Yes, yes.. let's get PJ in here..

<papercut> Brian is whipping Eric's ass tonight ;-)

<pablo7> init2null: right on! what an exciting show.

<egibbs> has PJ been invited to the show

<nyet> not academic

<nyet> not r&d

terracon []

has joined #linuxshow

<Eggplant> email her

<ROM> I dunno.. it was posted on grok

<Eggplant> I wish I had emailed her

<nyet> software is NOT the only revenue stream

<mwg> Reverse how?


?articleId=22100621 <-- *LOOK HERE* 10.7M profit

<ROM> but she might not have seen it.

<nyet> dont

<papercut> Is Eric asleep?

<nyet> make money selling solutions

<toga> KevDude: Please turn down this shitheads volume.

<ROM> I only saw it an hour before


<JZA> wtf....

<LinuxItch> fucking shit --- it's not reversing the IP model - it's changing


<peragrin> IT DOESN"T EXSIT

<Eggplant> papercut: he can't hog the show, man

<boneski> SCO

<JZA> peragrin, SCO

<nyet> SCO

<prl> You don't understand what "IP" IS!


<nyet> SCOSource

<papercut> Eggplant: heh

<peragrin> SCO is Losing badly

<Curt-> Linus Torvalds is making a good living. Does he know that?

<nyet> which is making TONS of money

<cmcnabb> WTF? The "Paid for lproprietary license" is a relatively new thing

in IP. It really didn't start till the mid 70s.

<pablo7> ken "i don't believe non-scientific happy talk" brown

<nyet> SCOSource is a grandslam

<ROM> IP is a STUPID term

<vladster> mmccune, I lost your email address when I wiped my machine, could

you send it to me when you can?

<terracon> man I just tuned in. Who is this troller

<toga> Mr. profit?

<ROM> IBM makes money off of patents

<Ranger> Move the topic back to linux authoriship??

<LinuxItch> IBM never said that as far as i know.

<JZA> Ask the brasilian dude that said that licencing is a diying model and is

just 20% of their model

<egibbs> was ESR warned to play nice?

<p0z3r> Mr. Profit?

<Galik> No. IT money comes from people who do not understand IT paying money

to people who do understand IT to solve their IT problems for them

<mmccune> Most of the software is written for INTERNAL use. Giving money to

software companies means less profit.

<Eggplant> they can own all the software they want!!! welcome back to the

world of COMPETITION!!

<ROM> nobody says GPL your patents

<papercut> Fuck you Brown..

<JZA> Segui

<peragrin> IP has no legal definition

<JZA> something

<mwg> Mr. Brown, calm down, you are sputtering a bit.

<Arne> toga - Brian Proffit of Linux Today

<LinuxItch> I can see eric boiling

<ROM> IP is bull

<init2null> ooh, he's getting his feathers a bit ruffled.

<nyet> no you pay for integration, consulting, and support

<nyet> which is added value

<JeffM> uuuuggg I can stay on here anymore this guy is bullshit!!!!

<ct> ESR must be ready to explode

<NigelS> he's lying sooooo much

<papercut> Eric has gone for ammo (er, joke)

<boneski> moron, websphere uses apache

<ROM> patents, copyrights, trade secrets, be specific

<prl> He does know that GPL explicitly permits payment, right?

<nyet> IP offers customers ZERO added value

<nyet> IP offers customers ZERO added value

<NZheretic> That open source software runns on IBM hardware!

<toga> Arne: hehe wrong ref.

<Eggplant> it is my idea... I thought of it and it is mine.... anyone remember

that Monty Python??

<roblimo> Okay, I'm on the phone.

<jose> That's Capitalism, asshole!

<opus> Let me ask a common sense question to this asshole! Why on earth did

IBM spend a billion in advertising Linux last year including float

Linux across the SUPER BOWL if this is all a bunch of crap!

<LinuxItch> This is a waste of time.

<pablo7> ken "IP all over myself" brown

<Ranger> As soon as Tomcat/jboss is better than websphere, IBM won't sell it..

<papercut> roblimo: Yay!

<peragrin> Specail software isn't used by everybody

<asaone> lol

<nyet> IP is not added value

<Eggplant> sell all the closed source products you want!!


<LinuxItch> did roblimo just call in??

<LinuxItch> great!!!

<peragrin> I don't need websphere for home

<vladster> He isa deliberatly trying to steer the subject away from his own

short comings to his arguments

<Eggplant> we'll make our open source, you guys do your thing, we'll do ours.

<roblimo> Waiting to be brought in, yes.

<papercut> Go rob!

<Eggplant> if the world decides we become more popular, tough shit?

<jrzagar> The reason you buy software from a vendor is for the software


<nyet> IP is anti free-market

SignOff JeffM: #linuxshow (Quit: Leaving)

<ROM> I want to hear about samizat researchnow

<Valour> Sourceforge is free to free projects... still sold to corps

<boneski> wanker!

<toga> Pleaseeeeee.....

<nyet> IP is corporate welfare, ken

<peragrin> Arne: You don't need Websphere for home, You do need an OS though

<papercut> toga: This guy is spreading shit

<nyet> IP is a subsidy

<ROM> OH LORD this man is clueless

<LinuxItch> ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! open source owners OWN

their IP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

<LinuxItch> aaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

<pablo7> open source == capitalism, 1

<nyet> IP is protectionist and anti-captialist

<LinuxItch> what's wrong with this idiot


<linuxlobbyist> papercut: And the stink is pervasive

<ROM> Look at the monkey

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<ROM> look at the silly monkey

<Eggplant> rofl

<mmccune> protectionism != capitalism

<papercut> linuxlobbyist: :)

<LinuxItch> it's like talking to the wall

<ROM> *head explodes*

<opus> OH BARF!

<asaone> please do that

<opus> LGPL!

<boneski> clear!?

<peragrin> HAHAHAHA

<Eggplant> that's what they want!! Protection from a TRUE COMPETITOR!

<opus> OH BARF! LGPL!

<toga> Midnite?


<Ranger> I notice a pattern. He is shouting down his distractors. He isn't


<LinuxItch> I'm german and polish and italian. I'm STUBBORN - but not nearly

as much as this jack ass

<jeremy_lq> pull the rug out??


<mwg> ROM=StrongBad? "MY HEAD A SPLODE"


<opus> I want to be clear here! Your a clueless idiot!

<nyet> it does work

<Eggplant> Ford owns the IP behind the car!

<LinuxItch> keep it going

<peragrin> a little while longer then Closed source is gone

<boneski> 90% of software is written in house. what's is he on about?

<Ranger> Egg in the face until he is right??

<jeremy_lq> that is a multi-billion dollar rug

<papercut> Yay!

<Eggplant> yay rob!!!

<ROM> Was from southpark... jonny cochrane

<jose> The OS is free, the applications with the Big Blue support will cost.

This is business

<papercut> Go rob!

<nyet> go rob

<toga> We know........

<uteck> I think the web site will be /.ed tomarrow when roblimo posts this.

<LinuxItch> haha!!!

<NigelS> "IBM was already well into Linux territory last year and was not only

selling Linux-based systems to corporations but was also offering

innovative Linux On Demand services where computing-as-a-utility fit

the bill. The company announced last month that a beta version of

DB2 is running with SuSE Linux on AMD's 64-bit Opteron processor.

For the year, IBM calculated Linux sales of $1 billion, inducing

HP's Carly Fiorina to make a more extravagant claim of $2 billion

<Curt-> Oh, ouch!

<linuxlobbyist> And I thought it was weird when Fluery was a guest...this is


<Eggplant> rofl!!!

<papercut> lol

<toga> hahaha



<linuxlobbyist> ls

<NZheretic> Powerful SDK Use the software development kit (SDK), which

supports more than 1,900 UNIX APIs and migration tools (conforming

to the IEEE 1003.1-1990 standard), such as make, rcs, yacc, lex,

cc, c89, nm, strip, gbd, as well as the gcc, g++, and g77


<mmccune> Oh God!

<boneski> fsck. I could have whacked him

<linuxlobbyist> oops, wrong window

<papercut> A real journo!

<peragrin> jose: exactly, why pay for software that everybody needs, not

everybody needs websphere

<ROM> Sweet


<Eggplant> rob: keyboard, man.

<Eggplant> and monitor

<nyet> owned

<Galik> hehe

<nyet> hahaah

<Eggplant> rofl!

<papercut> lol

<Curt-> ROFL

<mmccune> Have him bend over!

<nyet> "ever seen a crisp 50 dollar bill?"

<LinuxItch> rob - exactly right


<peragrin> Easyist dinner every had

<linuxlobbyist> Watch it, Brown, he's testing you

<Eggplant> I'm wetting myself here

<NigelS> fear the gom jabbar

<Eggplant> stop

<nyet> brown is beyond this

<Eggplant> please

<boneski> what about kernel crap?

<opus> We are embarrased by you chilen.

<pablo7> ken "if your not with M$, you have better have your patents in order"


<Arne> linuxlobbyist - He's getting ready to jerk the hook...

<opus> He just needed an adult buddy in the end.

<SystemError> "We don't talk about money with anybody ... but we'll accept

money from anybody," he said.-- Ken Brown, 2004-05-19

<Curt-> This is embarrassing.

<LinuxItch> do you see what he's doing --- he's proving that brown is

'buyable' --- by anyone - including M$

<linuxlobbyist> I can't wait

<mwg> Matter & Anti-matter...

<mmccune> Open to your ideas = I'll believe anything for a buck.

<LinuxItch> he just proved that ken brown can be bought to say anything

<nyet> i can't believe brown is biting

<prl> Please ask about Linux and Minix, pretty please.


<Eggplant> prl: go, man, go....

<vladster> Goebals jr.

<nyet> smart lobbiests do NOT advertise their price



<ROM> an idea which he calls "hybrid source" and says destroys jobs and "IP"

<mwg> opus: RMS won't come here unless it is renames the GNU/Linux Show.

<LinuxItch> Arne: ask him about the minix thing

<prl> Please ask about ASTs comments! Go on...

<nyet> hahahaah

<vladster> we want richard

<nyet> hahahahahaha

<nyet> that was cute

<Curt-> My respect for Roblimo just went way, way up.

<peragrin> Brown is being an idiot. He still doesn't understand

<LinuxItch> someone please ask about Minix and where he got that load of crap


<papercut> mwg: LOL

<ROM> MWG: That's GNU/Richard

<Eggplant> rob's a good guy.

<papercut> Oh fuck off Brown

<LinuxItch> roblimo: beautiful job

<vladster> I don't get no respect

<pablo7> it's GNU/Linux, Mister.

<NZheretic> the Free BSDs would not exist - they all rely on the GCC compiler


<linuxlobbyist> Brown just doesn't get it...he's proven that he can be bought

<jose> He is trying to hog the conversation and turn it to where he is


<boneski> papercut, hehe

<toga> Not like the BSD license

<JZA> take the Disney example

<ROM> Yeah, NZ, I think that's why SCO is going after GCC now

<Curt-> How could the GPL put a black mark on RMS? Didn't RMS write it / have

it written?

<JZA> and the lil Mermaid

<vladster> I told the old lady , you're killing me. she replied, you are noit

worth it!

<papercut> GNU/Arne

<NigelS> no he doesn't he doesn't respect a thing about it



<boneski> who's this? ALi g?

<peragrin> BULLSHIT he respects only Money

<papercut> boneski: lol

<prl> Look, he doesn't understand copyright, so talking about "IP" and

licenses is pointless!

<ROM> he respects it but he will badmouth it and write a book on how it's

filled with stolen code

<vladster> I see where he4 is getting his money when he talks

<LinuxItch> float like a butterfly ... sting like a son of a "B"

<boneski> reshpect

<papercut> :)

<Eggplant> let the proprietary software live in its own world, then

<toga> Because propritory sucks

SignOff SystemError: #linuxshow (Quit: Leaving)

<JZA> but what is it working then

<Galik> Then proprietary WILL die :)

<prl> Ask about Toptygin's study

<LinuxItch> i love rob's chuckle

<Eggplant> and again, if the free model becomes more popular, oh, well...

<JZA> but what is it working then!!!

<pablo7> r+e+s+p+e+c+t find out what it means to me...

<peragrin> Did someone ask him about the copyright violations in samizdat

<Eggplant> times change

<opus> I swear Arne and Ken sound idential. Ken is just singing in a lower


<prl> Aww, go on......

<uteck> If it was not for BSD, MS would not be around since they would have to

write their own IP stack.

<Eggplant> forcing static conditions is not possible

<roblimo> peragrin, arguing with a paid advocate is a waste. He's *paid* to

hold his position. You want to convert him, you hire him away.

<Ranger> Back to IBM.. Sun.. What does he mean closed and open doesn't mex??

<ROM> you know you know

<LinuxItch> roblimo: exactly right

<roblimo> Note that I'm not arguing positions with him. It's pointless.

<Arne> opus - should I change my voice???

<mwg> Answer the question, Mr. Brown.

<jeremy_lq> no he doesn't

<opus> Get him off show Arne.

<papercut> roblimo: He's enjoying himself isn't he?

<Galik> corner...

<mmccune> Software = Raw materials

<peragrin> roblimo: No did someone ask him about the copyright voilations he

is being charged with?

<Eggplant> yes, don't answer the question, evade

<cmcnabb> roblimo: Do we need a "Hire Ken Away" fund?

<pablo7> IP >> 0 == commoditized, ken.

<ROM> is this ESR talking?

<Eggplant> and we do that by commoditizing the software

<Curt-> What he saw coming was a dead end for him, he avoided it.

<opus> Have the kev dude put an echo on him Arne.

<Eggplant> profit

<Eggplant> everyone can profit

<Statman> For someone who's only been kinda, sorta listening while taking help

desk calls - who is this idiot?!

<roblimo> cmcnabb, we can do better.

<Eggplant> and the stuff still need someone to support it.

<Eggplant> profit

<opus> We are all Catholics here? This guy is a religious racists.

<vladster> The governement paid 700$ for hammers and toilet seats

<LinuxItch> that "we're all capitalists" quote scares me when he repeats it.

he gets paid by the word

<Arne> opus - Like a two or three second echo.

<cmcnabb> rob: I concur. I think Linus would make a much better spokes

person than Ken.

<opus> Yeah Arne.

<pablo7> or the history of the PC, for that matter.

<mmccune> "What is good for GM er Microsoft is good for America!"

<Eggplant> exactly!!!

<peragrin> roblimo: according to Sanizdat contains copyrighted

text from

<papercut> roblimo: How much do you think he's being paid?

<LinuxItch> opus: he said 'capitalist' not 'catholics'

<toga> Not without tivo patents!!!!

<opus> This Ken guy is getting on my nerves my fellow italians.

<Curt-> Capitalism: Private ownership of the means of production. Let's not

read more into it than it really is.

<Eggplant> gotta make money on the softwar3e

<roblimo> papercut, around $80K.

<opus> Oh, okay.

<toga> BS!!!!!!!

<ROM> *barf*

<Eggplant> he'd have one car manufacturer in his world

<vladster> don't talk to me about the cars

<papercut> roblimo: wow

<boneski> LinuxItch, lol

<LinuxItch> no it is not!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

<jdr> Oh please!

<Eggplant> chrysler stole ford's IP!

<mwg> 100% of the value in a car is that it gets me to where I need to go.

<vladster> They have cheapened them no end

<uteck> What IP is in a car?

<papercut> Oh no! Car analogies!!

<Eggplant> mercedes stole Ford's IP!

<NigelS> lol, no differentiation with OS?

<toga> Whitewalls ;)

<LinuxItch> you can compete on cost, reliability, color, artistic value

<ROM> And the same gasoline

<boneski> Eggplant, mercs were the first car

<prl> Licenses? To change the oil??

<papercut> So what about the body in the boot?

<LinuxItch> this guy is an idiot.

<mmccune> Eggplant: Ford god sued for producing cheap cars. Fortunately, Ford

won and the other car makers are history.

<Eggplant> and legality and bullshit and let's charge all we can

<toga> On their property

<Eggplant> mmccune

<LinuxItch> i'm not even going to get mad at him. i actually feel sorry for


<Eggplant> yep

<vladster> \Mercedes will send Russian goons to anyone who has a problem with


[msg(plunk)] still here ?

<Eggplant> I'm just surmising what this dude's about

<JZA> I think is late

<ROM> mmccune: yes exactly

<LinuxItch> volume

<papercut> Let Rob speak

<JZA> and I think I will download this show


<JZA> :D

[plunk(] yep

<opus> We should bring this guy back next week and kick his ass again.

<Valour> Thank goodness Ken Brown is a moron. A competent man could really

spar with these people.

<Curt-> Brown's good at getting around the roadblocks.

<boneski> what about the KERNEL!?

<vladster> can you spell RPG

[msg(plunk)] your DCC works ?

<init2null> don't be harsh. he's like an attorney. he totally repeats the

opinion of his employer.

<Eggplant> curt: he's good at backpedalling and evasion

<pablo7> where do you want to go, ken?

<roblimo> init2null, exactly

<toga> Oh oh Brown on cars!!

<LinuxItch> oh -- he's working on a paper -- it must be true

<Galik> interviewing again?

<opus> 'I completely disagree with you man'

<ROM> Ken isn't a moron... he's just being difficult and doing his job of

being a spokeman for his funders

<Eggplant> hah!

<uteck> Ford makes no money from selling from cars? Get real Ken

[plunk(] I haven't tried it. maybe it does.


<nyet> trade secret vs patent

[dcc(SEND)] plunk

<Statman> So our process is developing in the open so everyone can benefit -

compete against that and go away loser.

<nyet> trade secret != ip kenny

<Eggplant> and how do you know that's not been stolen stuff being used?

<Eggplant> in the processes?

<LinuxItch> there's a difference between IP in processes and IP in cars

<toga> One-click patent?

<prl> Pleeeeeeease ask about why all his interviewees have said he distorted

what they said???

<opus> Hey Cheetch! Try this space coke here.

<nyet> nope most are trade secrets

<nyet> not patents

<ROM> Cars are open source

[ctcp(plunk)] VERSION

CTCP VERSION reply from plunk: KVIrc 3.0.0-beta2 "T-Rex" :

2003.01.04-12554 : build Wed Mar 17 00:53:23 UTC 2004 :


<ROM> you can take them apart

DCC SEND with plunk[] established

DCC SEND:USS-Hartford.pdf [46.26kb] to plunk completed in 1.603 secs

(28.86 kb/sec)

<jdr> This guy doesn't read "Automotive Engineering" magazine!

<cmcnabb> That's bull. I worked in manufacturing for a very very long time.

The processes aren't that much different. The differences are in

Quality and how much the manufacturer cuts corners.

<ROM> and see how they are made

<asaone> Ken is a good lacky

[plunk(] Thanks

<LinuxItch> that's fine - but the car ITSELF isn't a secret.

<init2null> patents are supposed to be open trade secrets.

<nyet> car making is well known

<Ranger> So the MS secret is their development process???

<Eggplant> every machine shop around here -- and believe me, it's nothing

*but* auto manufacturing in this city -- all make stuff and use

their own proprietary methods.

<MacBeach> no, he's a bad one.

<roblimo> Bad analogies, people...

<nyet> nothing is making a car is patentecd

<mwg> I routinely get my mini-van serviced by people who don't work for the


<nyet> s/in/is

[msg(plunk)] Long live OOo-1.1 :)

<LinuxItch> ask ken brown if he's ever heard of a shop manual that you can buy

for $75

<papercut> Ken is enjoying himself

<Curt-> But the SAE publishes open standards for those cars.

<roblimo> nyet, they're starting to patent their software...

<opus> Is it Ken or KIM?

<nyet> car industry is driven by branding, not patenting

<ROM> No more car analogies

<Eggplant> nothing different in the software world. We're just making our own

shit, but not using the same source code that the big boys are.

We're writing our own!

<Galik> He's confusing patents with blueprints

<asaone> lol

<pablo7> somebody weld the hood on this analogy.

<Arne> papercut - We're all enjoying this, also.

<NZheretic> "Just as the automotive industry can commonize on standards for

the production of the mechanisms of seats, instrument panels and

doors while providing brand and regional differentiation across a

wide array of models, the information technology community can

collaboratively develop works under free licenses."

<papercut> Arne: True :)

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<toga> I'm going, this is just too much bullshit. Nite guys. Need to work on

daughters computer.

<Ranger> Publish you comments Ken..

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<opus> Who's #1 in China today!

<LinuxItch> I have a headache. I can't believe I let myself get upset about

this shit

<boneski> sod this car crap

<nyet> rob, but thtats to bolster their dealers

<ROM> Patents are not copyrights are not source code

<cmcnabb> Eggplant: We are casting our own blocks and pistons instead of

buying the ones from the Big Three.

<papercut> night toga

<NZheretic> "Just as the automotive industry can commonize on standards for

the production of the mechanisms of seats, instrument panels and

doors while providing brand and regional differentiation across a

wide array of models, the information technology community can

collaboratively develop works under free licenses."


<JZA> yeah but you patent the product not the components

<roblimo> (sigh)

<opus> Who's #1 in China today!

<linuxlobbyist> He's full-o-shit

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<Eggplant> cmcnabb: indeed!

<prl> Is anyone transcribing this?

<pablo7> ken "auto indrusty insider" brown

<nyet> repair depts are becoming huge cost centers

<papercut> No more car analogies, please!!

<opus> Who's #1 in China today! GM and LINUX!

<jeffgus> redhat had a "secret" process that kept them ahead of the pack

<LinuxItch> I'm not worried at all about ADTI and it's b/s reports. i'm not

worried at all.

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<boneski> full-of-shit or he's utter shitw

<Eggplant> prl: I think I've got logging on. I could be wrong

<jeffgus> but the result was still open

<ROM> Linux is the TOOLS

<nyet> rob; theyr are trying to lock in the repair service market

<nyet> rob; not prevent people from "copying" their cars

<papercut> Argument by analogy. It'll end in tears..

<ROM> Not the car

<BKP> Is this the fun part? Are we having fun yet?

<Galik> we know the wiring diagrams too

<roblimo> I have a *specific* question I can't get in about Prentice Hall and

Linux and Ken's accusations

<prl> No, I meant transcribing Ken B.

<Eggplant> so?

<LinuxItch> software has only 1 way to be written - with a keyboard and


<cmcnabb> ROM: That's right. Linux is the lathe, the mill, the drill press

that is used to create the parts that make the parts.

<Eggplant> If I decide to make a car tomorrow, and leave the processes open

for others, am I committing a crime?

<peragrin> Nope he doesn't understand

<Galik> we know how every nut attaches to every bolt

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<asaone> hay this is the best 50 buck I have spent

<init2null> what company doesn't?

<ROM> And the steel and the rubber and the plastic too

<opus> This Ken Brown guy is so clueless, it's unbelievable. Does he possess

a drivers license? Are we shareing our highways and city streets

with peole like Ken Brown? Doesn't that scare your more than AL K.

<Eggplant> what if I do it differently and achieve the same results?

<peragrin> Does this guy understand reverse engineering???

<BKP> Roblimo: I want to pop him for his pro open source crack. He still as

that jab about OS and LT on the AdTI site...

<cmcnabb> Processes should *NOT* be patentable. Only physical inventions.

<jdr> Ken can disagree all night long. He has no facts.

<Ranger> He knows nothing about software. It shows, It is obviois..

<papercut> Stop the analogies Mommy! I'm getting scared..

<nyet> 99% of cars are dead on balls identical

<jeffgus> doesn't IBM have a pentent with regards to opensource process?

<jeffgus> patent

<BKP> jdr: And *that's* the problem...

<pablo7> M$ doesn't reverse engineer, just uses software that's BSD licensed.

<Eggplant> so?

<opus> See what 15 minutes of research can buy you Ken!

<Eggplant> fuck their patents, we're not dealing with their patents!

<vladster> just try and get a title and license for it

<jeffgus> i thought i saw something about that once

<ROM> Stop with the stupid CAR talk please

<JZA> yeah but is the process not the material

<Eggplant> we haven't even seen their processes!

<roblimo> JeffGerhardt, I have a *specific* question re Prentice Hall

<bob> Hes declaired war on the GPL. I say so be it. Let slip the dogs

<LinuxItch> jeffgus: yes, they do

<prl> In the 19th century, nuts and bolts were standardised openly, precisely

because there was no point in making non-interchangable parts.

<ROM> Talk about Linux

<linuxlobbyist> He's lying

<JZA> yeah but is the process not the material

<Eggplant> all we're doing is using *our own* ideas and making the end result

the way we want it

<JZA> software is the material not the process



<mmccune> pablo7: or "partner" with a company then steal their code.

<boneski> ford use open source software. I know because I've written stuff for


<vladster> yay Eli Whitney

<Ranger> So a corp values their patents. What has that got to do with software

and open source???

<cmcnabb> nyet: I own a 63, an 82, and a 98. All are different. but all use

the same basic principle - burn gas very fast in a cylinder and use

<jdr> Ken, you're right.

<Galik> How many car manufacturers actually make cars based on licensed

designs? not many thay usually design their own

<papercut> linuxlobbyist: Some would for $80k

<jdr> Microsoft is dead meat.

<asaone> we will win

<Eggplant> he made one true statement in taht last sentence: I don't think

<nyet> cmcnabb: i have a heavily hacked car myself :)


<Galik> We are good you are bad

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<stock> jdr they should DO something

<jeffgus> linuxlobbyist, ;)

<nyet> cmcnabb: the ECU "secrecy" is a load of crap

<vladster> check out

<Eggplant> it's a black and white world we all live in

<TomWitt> One very clueless guy

<nyet> cmcnabb: it makes making my car fastser very hard

<roblimo> Oy! They persist in arguing with a paid advocate. Why?

<Galik> Our dad is bigger than your dad :P

<NigelS> one guy with murky corporations behind him

<LinuxItch> that's the problem - those are your OPINIONS - not FACTS

<jose> Yea, lets keep the patent on swinging side to side.

<pablo7> mcccune: ken advocates buying out IP.

<GEORGE> mIcrosoft is based on open source hardware

<vladster> the crankshaft is gone in way of lobes

<papercut> roblimo: Exactly

<cmcnabb> nyet: I ripped the ECU out of my 82 bronco. It is now computer

less with a 4 bbl carb and 100HP more than stock.

<LinuxItch> GEORGE: that's a good point

<mwg> I think some phone systems attempted that, eventually they failed.

<papercut> At least make the guy work for his money!

<boneski> it happened with the railways in the UK

<GEORGE> open source hardware is where were asre today

<linuxlobbyist> This is the second time (at least) he backpedaled and said it

was his *opinion* not his research

<BKP> roblimo: So what do you want to do?

<prl> Seriously, guys, please stop trying to convince him about FLOSS, and

just ask why he was lying in "Samizdat"

<Valour> "These are my opinons. If you don't like them, I have others."

<papercut> boneski: Railways in the UK Eeek!

<roblimo> I am about to go back to working on my book. This has gotten silly.

<GEORGE> use microsoft and open source hardware

<nyet> cmcnabb: i have a modded audi s4

<Eggplant> prl! good point!!!

<JeffGerhardt> rob>makes for interesting radio though

<Eggplant> what about the lies!!

<boneski> time is running out. come on address the sodding linux issue

<papercut> yup

<peragrin> Valour: I am paid good money to spew these opinions

<nyet> cmcnabb: the have tools to tweak parameters, but no full engine

management solution

<roblimo> BKP, I want to ask one relevant question and can't get it in.

<ROM> And when did phone bills get cheap? When service was commoditized

<nyet> cmcnabb: i am FORCE to use the stock ecu

<papercut> clueless fucker

<nyet> s/force/forced

<JeffGerhardt> he does not consider them lies

<jrzagar> better example: The Internet Protocol (the other IP).

<NigelS> but A G Bell only beat Elisha Grey to the stupid patent office by a

matter of hours

<JZA> actually you see that right now with Cellphone Tools

<pablo7> bell had great lobbyists too.

<ROM> Telephone service is so much better now

<GEORGE> how aBOUT pc market any money made there?

<LinuxItch> someone hand me the cluestick ... the big one

<JeffGerhardt> its the information he used as his source material

<asaone> he did not invent the telephone, he got the patient first

<JZA> each cellphones has a different implementation of tools

<jrzagar> IP beat decnet, token ring, etc... because of low barriers to entry

<BKP> JeffGerhardt: Let Rob get his PHall Q in!

<papercut> $80k? I want his job..

<prl> JeffGerhardt: Actually, I disagree, this has been fairly boring for the

last 5 minutes.

<cmcnabb> nyet: I use a flat blade screwdriver to tweak engine parameters.

<BKP> :)

<Valour> peragrin: heh, well, me too

<asaone> by 4 hours

<GEORGE> ibm pc is open

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<nyet> cmcnabb: i use a tool called "lemmiwinks" lol

<Eggplant> address the linux authorship stuff, guys

<nyet> runs on a laptop

<ROM> Nasa?

stock lets move the crosshairs and AIM at Gaim!

<init2null> the internet is the best example of cooperative development, i


<nyet> connects thru the obd

<boneski> GEORGE, MCA wasn't

<prl> Bell co was eventually split up as a monopoly

<opus> JeffGerhardt : it's been 1 hour and 45 minutes Jeff. Time to pull his


<Curt-> This guy is a completely idiot. Dump nasa

<Statman> lol stock

<LinuxItch> opus: no way -- keep this going

<TomWitt> Yes, we want this guy involved with rockets

<Eggplant> I wanna hear more. this is too funny

<papercut> Mr Brown is leading the proceedings. Maybe he's not so lame..

<jose> Jeff, tell him GOOD NIGHT!!!

<Galik> So we can't run an industry on the proceeds of pure science?

<ROM> Nasa is the BSD of science

<mwg> ANd the relevance to NASA is?

<Ranger> So, we now have a acedemic model that actually produces a product.

What is wrong with that??

<LinuxItch> JeffGerhardt: please don't cut this guy off. we can't let him

leave like this.

<papercut> Classic misdirection

<BKP> Argh!

<papercut> A good politician

<jdr> Let's replace Alan Greenspan with Ken Brown!

<pablo7> and when NASA gets M$ they be better off?

<BKP> Rob: Louder!

<boneski> are we going to completely ignore the kernel issue?

<ROM> Talk about Linux and the Samizadt research

<Severian> You have got to ask him if Linus wrote Linux. Please, before you

miss your chance.

<peragrin> What model is he talking about??? the one he keeps spewing about

doesn't exsit



<papercut> Get control of the feckin' show!!

<Eggplant> it's over

<boneski> Samzadt

<boneski> Samzadt

<boneski> Samzadt

<boneski> Samzadt

<Eggplant> it's over johnny....

<boneski> Samzadt

<Eggplant> over?

<Eggplant> nothing

<prl> THANK YOU!!!

<Eggplant> 's over until we say it is

<prl> Yo, go with Minix!

<Statman> Was it over when the German bombed Perl Harbor?

<papercut> Go rob

<NigelS> Statman: that would be the Japanese :)

<pablo7> i have no recollection of that senator roblimo.

<boneski> Statman, german?

<Galik> he was careful not to libel himself

<Arne> Sticklish????

<Eggplant> no! so c'mon let's get those commie bastards!!

<opus> Didn't say that Rob! Didn't say that Rob! Didn't say that Rob! BOOO


<Galik> he chose his words carefully

<Statman> Okay - those that are saying Japanese - please go rent "Animal


<peragrin> What you wrote was lies

<nyet> read us what you wrote kenny

<Galik> he chose his words very carefully

<Eggplant> what he wrote was lies indeed

<boneski> fat chance

<cmcnabb> Galik: Most paid shills do select their words carefully.

<nyet> yes please

<mmccune> NigelS: He has been watching too much "Animal House".

<Eggplant> please address that point

<Curt-> Metaphor my butt.

<prl> METAPHOR???

<NigelS> "you lied in the no-spin zone Rob! I'm not going to entertain you

quoting me!"

<ROM> But there was no MINIX code in Linux

<nyet> ah mETApHoR!

<nyet> as an observer, he's allowed to use metaphors

<Eggplant> there was no minix code in linux

<pablo7> blah, blah, blah...

<peragrin> Minix is Micro Kernel Linux is Macro kernel

<init2null> metaphor? it is completely tied to the linux "debate"!

<MacBeach> Yeah, no spin zone. Give him "the last word" and then rebut

whatever he has to say, hehe

<prl> Ken, can I introduce you to a company called SCO? They'd love to hear

your "metaphor" theory

<Eggplant> there were ideas that were learned and then turned into a SEPARATE

work product

<opus> Minix is closed source.

<Eggplant> that's how we create NEW STUFF

<stock> opus wrong

<nyet> when we said Linux contains SYSV code, we meant that metaphorically

<prl> Ken ASK Prentice Hall!!

<opus> Minux WAS closed source.

<Statman> Minix -was- closed source. Isn't it open now? (wasn't when Linus

studied it)

<nyet> metaporical literal line by line copyiing

<ROM> Buy the minix book because it's a BOOK not to get minix

<ROM> thats why I buy Linux books!

<nyet> ahaha nice

<mwg> *ONE* *AT* *A* *TIME* ***PLEASE***

<LinuxItch> you need the book to UNDERSTAND minix

<Ranger> So?? Linux has more features than Minux.

<prl> Blackwell's in Oxford has 3 entire shelf sections devoted to O'Reilly

<mmccune> Statman: Minux had the source available but it wasn't Open Source.

<pablo7> what was your point, ken? so what.

<Eggplant> without the book, the software is meaningless

<opus> Does anybody here run any of the BSD's currently?

<init2null> he must not have bought the book. <g>

<Curt-> Yes, let Rob talk. He's leading Ken into a hole.

<Statman> gotcha

<Eggplant> books help and save us money

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<peragrin> He stole those copyrighted materials from the disscussion board.

<nyet> ken has no idea where rob is going lol

<LinuxItch> I have that book and i bought it when it came out. I never

understood it - maybe i'll go back and read it

<nyet> rob take it home

<papercut> He said piss. Naughty

<nyet> rob take it home

<MacBeach> I think Ken started out in a hole.

<Galik> errrr it's DIFFERENT code though

<prl> OK, go guyes

<Ranger> Time moves on Ken.

<nyet> as an observer some people might say things taht stupid

<jdr> He can't sell his book.

<NigelS> "I'm selling a book, right?" does he think we're idiots?

<jdr> Nobody wants it!

<stock> Prentice Hall sold a book on Minix and Minix media, for educational

purposes.... several people tried to enhance Minix and some did

succesfully, to make Minix of practical use as a PC Unix alike

OS..... Prentice Hall went after them, and won several legal cases

<jose> His statements

<MacBeach> No, Minix was a teaching Tool!

<cmcnabb> papercut: I think I was taking a piss when he said Piss. Damn.

<peragrin> Hasn't Prentice hall 20 or 30 times the number of Linux than



<prl> Ken, Minix was a learning tool for students.

<pablo7> ken "another crummy comparison" brown

<opus> I'm selling a book right? RIGHT! Right? RIGHT! Right? RIGHT! GET


<LinuxItch> it's a metaphor KEN!!!!

<NigelS> welcome tot he minuxshow folks!

<init2null> irrelevant? wow.

<boneski> twit. I like that

<Eggplant> get 'im rob

<linuxlobbyist> It's become clear...this is not to convince Ken Brown of

anything...only to let him make a fool of himself

<terracon> this guy is digging himself a deep hole

<BKP> He's arguing that technology obsolence/progress is bad!

<mmccune> Linux != Minux

<Ranger> So what is wrong with Minux and Llinux?? Should PH sue MS??

<papercut> cmcnabb: heh

<peragrin> LinuxItch: he can't understand big words like metaphor

IRCMonkey [] has joined


<stock> Minix

<boneski> terracon, quick cover him up

<Arne> That's Russ hammering away now.

<asaone> Profit, Profit, Profit, damn sounds like Bill Gates

<pablo7> shut up and listen, ken.

<NigelS> OK, right? This is, right? a metaphor right? alright, right?

boneski/#linuxshow notices helicopter is back

<Eggplant> right

<papercut> boneski: Get out of there!

<nyet> its a metaphorical wookie

<nyet> it makes no sense, prentice hall is based on endor

<NigelS> boneski: don your tin-foil hat quickly!

<ROM> But wasn'minix useless except as a teaching tool??

<peragrin> Why the book contians information that isn't in the sourrce code,

which is why you buy the book

<Newsome> Nobody 'runs' minix.

cmcnabb/#linuxshow wonders if helicopter showed up when Boneski started

listening to The Linux Show

<mmccune> ROM: Yes

<jdr> Ken Brown believes that all information should be controlled. It's that


<opus> right? RIGHT! Right? RIGHT! Right? RIGHT! --- Sounds like an old

german chant.

<Eggplant> why yes, I must always buy the book

<linuxlobbyist> If I read the book carefully, you be'er get me a bu'et

<Eggplant> the book is necessary

<plunk> Brown's book might be just a prop that supplies an excuse for him to

appear on talk shows.

<pablo7> how about that.

<NigelS> you have to eat with this guy? :) take a long spoon :P

<Ranger> Ah, Tanenbaum.. And his opiion of this idiot is? Hmm. I can

understand Andy's opionion..

<Eggplant> especially if I bought the book years ago and already know the

software that comes with it

<stock> Torvalds, several others were tired of the Prentice Hall drama , so he

wrote a new Unix alike OS from scratch... at the same time he

started on a i386, so the Linux OS became 32bit from the start.

Minix only ran on 16bit 8086 and 80286 PC's .

<asaone> yep your buying Ken

<Eggplant> charge me all the money you can!

<nyet> NigelS: rofl

<prl> jdr> And controlled by precisely those who pay AdTI

<linuxlobbyist> This guy's gonna go broke on dinners

<ROM> Ken should put Minux in every copy of Samizadt

<boneski> Tanenbaum was spot on with this nobhead

<jdr> prl> amen!

<nyet> here we go

<LinuxItch> eric: nice

<peragrin> Ranger: ya it becomes clear why Andy called him dense.

<nyet> take it home

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<Eggplant> so?


<Eggplant> this was about samizdat

<Eggplant> and ken brown and his smear job on linux

<boneski> Eggplant, clearly not

<Newsome> most of the books written 100 years ago aren't making any money


<NigelS> he's not talking about linux, about metaphors, about erm, anything


<Arne> Here goes ESR!!

<ROM> Andy said that all the attribution is done

<pablo7> ken "clear as mud" brown

<boneski> no is asking him about it


<papercut> Go Eric

<NigelS> Cry Havoc and unleash the dogs of ESR!

<Galik> ESR ESR ESR!

<mmccune> ESR, ESR ESR


<cmcnabb> Does linux owe attreibution to Minux? "I'd like to thank Minix for

the use of their compiler, and I'd liek to thank the academy for

this award"

<opus> You will listen punk child. We will slap you unless you listen.

<Ranger> Wow..

<boneski> Eric, can I borrow your gun?


<pablo7> shut up and listen, ken.

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<mmccune> This is getting to be like Jerry Springer!

<Eggplant> he has said it, talk to the man how has talked to the men who made

the statements

<prl> A note "Minux" is a small Linux distro, Minix is the teaching tool by


<asaone> I love it

<stock> Did Torvalds use Minix code ? of course not, as even The Inventor and

main coder of Minix : Tanenbaum, claimed. Torvalds in his view ,

mixed up the Minix OS very badly, he basicly ruined it, and made it

a bastard Monolithic Unix clone

<Eggplant> someone toss a chair

<mmccune> Shoot him ERic!

<peragrin> When Where jprovide proof SCO jr.

<opus> Pull down your pants punk child and accept our teachings.

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<Ranger> Yeah, we can look at his sight right now..

<asaone> my ass

<ROM> Eggplant: LOL

<papercut> Either way, this guy's book will sell..

<pablo7> ken "i'm outta my league here" brown

<jonesy> lol

<ROM> Attribution

<stock> bingo

<jdr> "C" was born with Unix. I understand parts of Windows are written in

"C". Uh Oh!

<Ranger> Read to exactly what Tanebaum says..

<Curt-> Wow.

<Eggplant> thank you

<ROM> how did he steal ideas from a microkernel

<peragrin> Bullshit that is stealing dumbass

<ROM> to make a monolithic kernel

NigelS/#linuxshow hands out popcorn

<asaone> no kidding

<Curt-> Oh no, not stole, "apropriated".

<nyet> hahahahhaah

<ROM> can someone explain this??

<opus> That's what 15 minutes of research will get you, punk child!

<asaone> you say a lot, and still say nothing

<Eggplant> yea, linux appropriated the IP

<stock> RE-USING IDEAS == REVERSE ENGINEERING , which is perfectly LEGAL

<Eggplant> tis all about the ip

<vladster> He learned from Minux but needed to resize the kernel to handle

more requirements and the original code got dumped

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<GEORGE> and Newton stood on the shoulders of Giants

<Galik> no but he DELIBERATELY used words that would confuse the point with

his readers...!!!!!

<pablo7> ken "M$-PR has trained me well" brown

<opus> Ask punk child if he can install, any version of Linux? Is punk child

smart enough.

mwg/#linuxshow puts ice on his speakers to keep them from melting...

<peragrin> stock: don''t confuse him with big words

<ROM> IT's not Lie-Nus it's linnnn-us

<BKP> 5-10 paragraphs != chapter...

<peragrin> 5 paragraphs = a chapter???


<pablo7> ken "i want to go on and on with this" brown


<stock> peragrin i want him to blow up his mike

papercut/#linuxshow watches Eric load his elephant gun

<vladster> He had to start from scratch to run the code on x86

<Eggplant> opus: IP

<Ranger> Tell him we have Andy's response to his interview right in front of


<Eggplant> heh

<Eggplant> stay on topic


<peragrin> LOL, some one teach this guy about reverse engineering

<stock> vladster a 8088 8068 80186 and 80286, all ran Minix

<Eggplant> minix was just the development platform

<stock> ehhh s/8068/8086/

<mwg> Voice overlap.....

<Galik> we know the difference BUT your readerd do not and YOU KNOW THAT!!!!

<papercut> Order! Order!

<vladster> I could not get then to run

<nyet> in the announcement of his kernel

<BKP> Fire two...

<papercut> I'm Spartacus!

<Statman> So when did Henry Ford give proper credit to the guy that invented

the wheel? What a crock...

<vladster> but then I got rid of the XT

<Eggplant> put the gun down, eric

<ROM> I love this email

<opus> Gentlemen, please choose a weapon, walk 50 paces then turn and fire!

<prl> ESR! ESR!

<LinuxItch> The act of attributing, especially the act of establishing a

particular person as the creator of a work of art.

<papercut> Eggplant: :)

<BKP> Go Arne!

<vladster> special thanks to OG

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<LinuxItch> Tanenbaum didn't create linux. Attribution is not required.

<mmccune> shoot hime Eric!

<opus> You feel lucky, punk child?

<Curt-> I wish ESR would keep his temper a bit, oh well. Then he wouldn't be


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<Eggplant> curt: indeed

<papercut> Curt-: NO! More blood!

<Eggplant> on the he wouldn't be

<stock> Torvalds started Linux, cause , like many others, wanted a 32 BITS

Unix clone on a i386 PC

<papercut> Shout damn you!

<opus> Bring on RMS immediately!

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<GEORGE> entertainig


<Eggplant> prabob


NigelS/#linuxshow munches more popcorn

<prl> Thank you!

<papercut> Go Arne

<nyet> legal or not

<nyet> ken

<stock> Tanenbaum REFUSED to create a 32 BIT Minix

<nyet> legal or not

<USSROVER> JeffGerhardt PM

<LinuxItch> "Intellect downtime"

<GEORGE> betterthan crossfire

<papercut> :)

<opus> That's what 15 minutes of research will get you, punk child!

<nyet> ken is linux a legal work free of copyrighted minux code

<nyet> legality

<peragrin> LinuxItch: you need an intellect first

<ROM> Andy doens't care, Linux doesn't care, AT&T didn't care, why the F***

does Brown care???>


<nyet> ken you are the big IP guy, is linux legal or not

<JZA> just go and check this

<papercut> $80k. Money for old rope..

<JeffGerhardt> this guy is so clueless it is scary

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<JeffGerhardt> ok quick vote

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mwg/#linuxshow graduates from ice on the speakers to liquid nitrogen...

<Eggplant> heh... I can see Eric in my head

<terracon> JeffGerhardt: so true

<JeffGerhardt> how many people want him back

<Eggplant> rofl!

<nyet> me

<linuxlobbyist> roblimo, I keep hearing you laughing in the background almost

like Dr. Evil

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<GEORGE> how about next year

<nyet> !vote yes

<LinuxItch> JeffGerhardt: definitely!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

<nyet> asap

<NigelS> JeffGerhardt: I bet he asks for help programming his VCR :)

<BKP> If he's willing...

<nyet> i was skeptical but this is great stuff

<opus> JeffGerhardt : We need to do the RedHat profitability debate yet.

<Eggplant> standards

<Eggplant> that's it

<papercut> Vote Twat

<jose> Roblimo sounds more like Mr Burns on the Simpsons

<Galik> LOL

<nyet> ken you are the big IP guy, is linux legal or not

<Eggplant> heh

<LinuxItch> JeffGerhardt: we need to straighten this guy out

<Statman> I can see the vein in ESR's head throbbing from here

<Eggplant> all these guys

<asaone> lol

<NigelS> "really smart guys" (TM)

<JZA> jeje

<opus> Ask punk child if he can install, any version of Linux? Is punk child

smart enough.

<mwg> I'm amazed that Brown has held still for all this heat.

<jdr> Oooooo, really smart guys!

<nyet> and you misquoted every one of them

<JZA> excellent

<Galik> NO NO NO!!!!

<mmccune> Jose: Excellent!

<nyet> ken you are the big IP guy, is linux legal or not

<Eggplant> lemme guess, ballmer, gates, mcbride, stowell, heise, etc

<ROM> He diddn't

<pablo7> Jeff: if he buys dinner bring him back, if not no way.

<nyet> ken you are the big IP guy, is linux legal or not

<prl> JeffGerhardt: clueless, yes, but not scary. I'm happier by the moment.

<LinuxItch> JeffGerhardt: let's get the red hat, ibm financials, and research

all this crap that he's betting dinner on. Get him back!!!

<NigelS> because it's not true maybe?

<init2null> i'm glad this is isn't restrained like most interviews. this fud

needs to be tackled.

<nyet> because its not true

<vladster> fry him.

<papercut> This guy is sounding more and more like Rocky

<jdr> Hey, I'm a really smart guy! I even walked on the MIT campus once! How

about quote me?


<NigelS> lol

<nyet> its an os

<boneski> does he not know what linux actualyl started with?

<nyet> yes

<nyet> you start with an idle loop

<peragrin> ROFLMAO this guy should go on tour, comedy central is looking for

idiots just like him.

<uteck> This is getting boring, he does not even understand what he is saying.

He is just running in circles.

<prl> Brown doesn't get this truth thing

<papercut> Kill the fudster. It's fun..

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<MacBeach> Everybody starts with BINARIES

<mmccune> If this guy is the best MS can do, I'm not worried.

mwg/#linuxshow wonders what he can use when the liquid nitrogen fails...

<vladster> I =neeed more memory, this is overloading to my disk cahe and the

window is hanging

<Eggplant> maybe

<Eggplant> the salus book

<nyet> ken, any 3rd year cs student can write an os

<pablo7> ESR is now teaching linux 101.

<Eggplant> eric's right

<nyet> ken, even if you cant

<peragrin> I always thought Software wrote it self?

<prl> He means the Lyon book

<ROM> Why is Brown so obsessed with Minix and "attribution"

<peragrin> am I wrong???

<Eggplant> GNU/Linux

<Arne> This guy is as slippery as a wet eel...

<jonesy> software is like twinkie filling... "It's just born there!"

<LinuxItch> peragrin: no -- software heals itself silly :)

<Eggplant> without GNU, Linux is worthless

<papercut> GNU/Bollocks

<nyet> ROM: because he needs to not be proven wrong

<Galik> no hes slippereyer

<nyet> ROM: he needs to keep his "credibility"

<BKP> ROM: Because he can use it as a lever against open source development

being hypocritical.

<Kent> JeffGerhardt: Don't get this guy back. It's a total waste of time to

talk to this idiot! You'll never change his mind, because he refuses

to listen.

<Ranger> You are not convinced, because you have no idea what programming is

all about..

<peragrin> Arne: he doesn't stick to anypoint, just like SCO so call him SCO


<NigelS> he can't cope with the idea of someone giving something with someone

not being owned by a corporation by something for which fees can't

be garnered

<asaone> he sells used cars on the side

<papercut> GNU/HURD = failure

<nyet> kent thats no the point, the point is this is infinitely entertaining

<linuxlobbyist> Arne: I prefer the analogy: slicker than shit

<Eggplant> no fees, no profit

<Eggplant> profit

<Eggplant> profit

<LinuxItch> Kent: I agree -- we'll never change his mind, but we need to be

able to definitely refute his statements.

<NigelS> papercut: we'll see :P

<pablo7> ken "my FUD is worth Million$" brown

<jose> Don't bring him back. He isn't listening and is spouting shit. IBM is

making money, but hasn't shown it to him so he doesn't believe it


<boneski> I can't believe can be this stupid. clearly being paid

<Arne> Eggplant - I agree (Gnu/Linux) but nobody has the time right now.

<prl> Can you just get him on why every interviewee says he lied in "Samizdat"

<Kent> nyet: No it's NOT.

<papercut> NigelS: ;-)

<Eggplant> arne: no probs I understaned

<nyet> well, ok. i can't speak for everyone, but im amused

<papercut> Lets have a debate!

<NigelS> papercut: GNU OS will live one day :)

<Curt-> Just look at the kernel subversion notifications. It's overflowing

with attribution.

<vladster> I need to get ready for work, I will catch the details on replay!

Uncle Arne fries him with his hex vision..............(Red Dwarf)

<LinuxItch> JeffGerhardt: get him back. we need to refute every last one of

these statements with hard facts.

<Eggplant> later vlad

<Ranger> I used a screwdriver from sears, and a wrench from my friend to build

a go cart.. So who owns my cart?

<LinuxItch> Go eric!

<opus> What we need here is a few stand seats, some ropes, and a pit of mudd.

<NigelS> !

<papercut> Shoot! Shoot!

<Eggplant> insulting

<GEORGE> Cooperative development

<pben> calm down!

mwg/#linuxshow watches his speakers glow with heat.

<Curt-> He knows it?

<prl> ESR, we're mostly egotists, so we're obsessed with showing off by

putting our Copyright notices up.

<nyet> proprietary software has infinitely larger attribution problems

Galik/#linuxshow hands an asparine to eric

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<peragrin> The reality is you don't lknow what you are talking about

<boneski> wanking then?

<Eggplant> insult us, do we not defend ourselves?

<NigelS> selling rights is like seeling Air

<Curt-> Damn, ouch. Earphones.

<pablo7> This is right out of RevolutionOS.

<Eggplant> money

<Eggplant> profit

<nyet> ken, no they dont

<NigelS> selling*

<LinuxItch> here he goes -- he's getting paid for this. i'm sure of it

<terracon> ESR is charring this guy

<Eggplant> ken is beholden to the almighty dollar

<GEORGE> how about microsoft making money on open hardware model

<nyet> attribution costs proprietary modles money

<papercut> Facts baby, facts..

<roblimo> LinuxItch, NO QUESTION

<opus> 'I have my kleenex out and I know it's obscene?'

<mmccune> nyet: MS has about 30 IP lawsuits against it now for stealing code.

<linuxlobbyist> His pants are down...and it IS obscene

<papercut> opus: lol

<nyet> proprietary software depends on not having attribution

<Eggplant> money is his master

<jose> See, he isn't listening. Don't bring him back.

<peragrin> How about MS making money off of selling SFU

<papercut> $80k

<nyet> ken, proprietary software NEVER has atrribtuion

<peragrin> by selling GPL products?

<linuxlobbyist> I think he meant OSI

<cmcnabb> So, how much code has Ken brown written?

<nyet> zero

<stock> _____ _ __ __ _ _

<stock> |_ _|____ _(_) ___ \ \ / /_ _(_)___| |_ ___

<stock> | |/ _ \ \/ / |/ __| \ \ /\ / / _` | / __| __/ _ \

<stock> | | (_) > <| | (__ \ V V / (_| | \__ \ || __/

<stock> |_|\___/_/\_\_|\___| \_/\_/ \__,_|_|___/\__\___|

<Eggplant> so?

<linuxlobbyist> No, I guess he did mean OSDL

<pablo7> blah, blah, blah, i don't want to answer any questions.

<cmcnabb> ^^^ abobve asked by Rob

<Eggplant> different is good

<uteck> Why is that Ken not attribute anything he says?

<Eggplant> everyone does their thing different

<peragrin> Arne: ask Ken about the BSD code in MS software

<init2null> he doesn't listen, but everyone else does. he *sounds* like an


<prl> Just get him on the distorted quotes, eh?

<papercut> Hate to say it, but this guy is in control.. twat or not..

<boneski> init2null, he's a paid idiot

<GEORGE> good point peragrin

<Eggplant> under the law?

<jonesy> he does sound like an idiot.

<init2null> yup

<asaone> Ken has ears closed, mouth wide open, eyes shut

<ROM> asaone: exactly

<Eggplant> asaone: see no evil, hear no evil

<boneski> openoffice

<terracon> asaone: unless you're paying him than ears open

<roblimo> My wireless handset just ran out of battery

<mmccune> Close ears and insert foot into mouth.

<asaone> and hand out looking for money

<pablo7> here he goes again.

<Ranger> He didn't let Eric finish.. Shout 'em down.. Shift the conversation..

He just won;t listen..

<asaone> yep

<mwg> Regardless what we think of his opinions, be nice to Mr, Brown. He

didn't *have* to do the show.

<opus> I just knew that Cathedral and Bizzare shit was all just a large hoax!

This ken guy is just god.

<Kent> He always "answers" a question with a question. He's an idiot!

<peragrin> Ken give up, you aren't smart enough to understand it.

<Ranger> He is way too wrapped up in the sound of his own voice.

<linuxlobbyist> If this guy walked into my office for an interview, I'd kick

him out after three words

<NigelS> I hope this IRC chat makes it into REv OS2 and they play it scrolling

in the background when they play this discussion :)

<papercut> A 19th century politician for sure..

<Eggplant> liquid break

<jonesy> Interestingly, his proof that people aren't making a profit on linux

has to come from the same place that the proof of profit actually

exists, in order to be credible.

<asaone> if he want's to understand it, shut up and listen

<Arne> ...more slippery than a wet slip-n-slide...

<Galik> He is clueless. But he is genuine in his beliefs. They are merely

founded on ignorance. And this is what we're up against. He

represents a LOT of people

<LinuxItch> mwg: I think he did have to do this show. sounds like his ego

feeds on this stuff - and so does his wallet

<Ranger> It he is trying to understand, speak less and listen more..

<roblimo> linuxlobbyist, Eric or Ken?

<uteck> This is going nowere and he just changed the subject again to cover

his own lack of proof.

<opus> Give me a claw hammer and about 10 minutes with Ken and I'll make him


<pablo7> does ken work for Sun too?

<linuxlobbyist> Ken Brown

stock Ken Brown, Jr. <== hmm did he also change his military records ?

<NigelS> darn connection to my ISP keeps dropping

<nyet> ken doesn't get paid by sun afaik

<papercut> I need to pee. Wish I could reach Mr. Brown (it might still be


<nyet> how about in proprietary code ken?

<roblimo> Totally amusing

<nyet> how about in proprietary code ken?

<Curt-> Yes, they have. SCO has found NO VIOLATING CODE YET! After a YEAR of


<Galik> Has anyone done the reserch on Microsoft's code?

<linuxlobbyist> I'd have to think carefully about Eric...he's a bit of loose

cannon...but I like sometimes ;-)

<jonesy> Totally frustrating. Completely pointless.

<linuxlobbyist> ^like^like it

<Eggplant> yeah, if we can't show the contract, he won't believe it's clean

<peragrin> Wired usally sucks

<nyet> software shops steal code all the time

<nyet> i've worked in several

<ROM> Yeah and Wired is the expert on writing software

<Galik> At least our code is OPEN to inspection!

<LinuxItch> Exactly - nonsense.

<NigelS> there you have it "it's nonsense"

<Ranger> referenes??

<nyet> we've stolen more code than ken can possibly imagine

<asaone> lol wired

<papercut> Wired magazine. Wow. Authority...

<Statman> Wired - a reputible source of Linux info (insert eye roll here)

<jdr> Ooooo, Wired is a reliable source!

<Eggplant> look the code over and find what was copied, it's freely available

to be looked through.

<Ranger> We have the internet right here...

<peragrin> SCO jr == Ken Brown

<LinuxItch> Even if the GPL needed to be re-done, afaik, ESR and OSI have


<jose> Plus it is open source so anyone can take it to court like SCO is doing

<NZheretic> I have just missed the last 20min.

<Eggplant> find the code in issue and go ahead and claim it

<opus> I'm heading for a shower than bed. CU all next week. Please clean up

the stage of any blood and small body parts left from this shit


<terracon> peragrin: yes!!

<Kent> He's using "wired" as a source of facts!

<papercut> :)

<NigelS> Ken Brown == Mini-SCO

<ROM> my brother

<jdr> At least Ken didn't stoop to "The Inquirer"!

<ric> hehe

<pablo7> yep, engineers say that for all practical purposes, it's clean.

<Curt-> ESR Right on!

<mmccune> Iread the wired article. That is not what it said. Besides, Wired is

not exactly a reliable source.

<ric> hes funny


<papercut> He's a one man SCO bless him

<Eggplant> m'man!

<NigelS> more like o' brother

<Eggplant> m'Brother!

<nyet> sorry ken

<Eggplant> shit, pimpdog

<papercut> Smack my bitch up bro'

<nyet> nope

<Eggplant> gimme some skin, g

<nyet> thats cars

<nyet> not iP

<boneski> "my man. my brother" jeez get back in the gheto you twat

<nyet> sorry ken you are daed wrong

<stock> nyet yeah, just watch the move : Anti Trust :

<asaone> I told you he sells used cars

<NigelS> he's a gangsta?

<nyet> ken that is NOT opinion

<Curt-> You may hav eto give the car back, but you're not LEGALLY LIABLE FOR


<papercut> boneski: lol

<pablo7> ken "i wanna write for the NY times" brown

<Ranger> These "programmers" know about IP that this idiot too!

<prl> If I buy a car in good faith, I may have to give it back, but the thief

goes to prison

<mwg> Is this Ken Brown ir Darl McBride?

<Eggplant> go through the code and find the stolen stuff it's out there

<ROM> yeah or the DARL option c) claim it, not prove it, and demand $700

<Curt-> mwg, paid for by the same people

<nyet> ahahah

<roblimo> Careful about the racist stuff... my *black* ex-cop wife is reading

over my shoulder...

SignOff opus: #linuxshow (Remote host closed the connection)

<Eggplant> it's in the open

<nyet> mitigation

<p0z3r> This sounds like Homey the Clown from In Living Colour!!

<papercut> Ken Brown I want my shit. Where's my shit bro'

<nyet> hahhahahaha

<Eggplant> why would anyone try to hide stolen code in open source??

<nyet> "whats teh duty of mitigation"

<nyet> what a dumbass

<peragrin> stock: don't watch anti-trust, the acting will kill you.

<init2null> The act of mitigating, or the state of being mitigated;

<init2null> abatement or diminution of anything painful, harsh, severe,

<init2null> afflictive, or calamitous; as, the mitigation of pain, grief,

<init2null> rigor, severity, punishment, or penalty.

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<boneski> papercut, too close to the trtuh

<roblimo> Our coders have contracts allowing them to do free software on the


<Kent> He needs no proof for what he says, but requires the "numbers" for

anyone elses statements.

<papercut> boneski: heh

<NigelS> peragrin: given the other hacker films out there, it's *relatively*

good :)

<Quietlife> any use ?

<cmcnabb> If I'm helping with a habitat for humanity house, and I steal a box

of nails from Home Depot, and use them on the house, do the poeple

who eventually get the house have to give it to Home Depot?

<linuxlobbyist> AHA, SCO was right! Eric works for IBM

<prl> Kerplunk, ESR pots the black.

<stock> "The act of mitigating, or the state of being mitigated; abatement or

diminution of anything painful, harsh, severe, afflictive, or

calamitous; as, the mitigation of pain, grief, rigor, severity,

punishment, or penalty."

<stock> "The act of mitigating, or the state of being mitigated; abatement or

diminution of anything painful, harsh, severe, afflictive, or

calamitous; as, the mitigation of pain, grief, rigor, severity,

punishment, or penalty."

<nyet> ouch

<Curt-> Ken Brown should ask SCO for a copy of the offending code that they


<ROM> Now we see the SCO funding at work

<pablo7> ken "all ESR's logic is wasted me" brown

<peragrin> Brown you stole interviews as well, Just ask

<p0z3r> And this guy works for a "think tank"?!

<pablo7> ken "all ESR's logic is wasted ON me" brown

<asaone> I have to say again this is the best 50 bucks I have ever spent

<Eggplant> let's hide millions of lines of stolen code in the open!

<Curt-> This guy HEADS a think-tank.

<mwg> Just how many different conversations are going on here?

<Kent> "I agree with you 100%, but....." Yah,right!

<jdr> The "Think Tank" was apparently drained.

<asaone> 10

<jonesy> yeah, Curt-, I don't get that.

<peragrin> mwg: 30 plus this one

<linuxlobbyist> lol


<papercut> Curt-: Yes. Scary, but money talks..

<p0z3r> how about the "dump tank"


<egibbs> tank was filled --hes under water

<nyet> not questionable

<nyet> anybody can litigate

<Eggplant> what litigation?

<peragrin> Ken does helping others mean anything to you???

<asaone> it would take a life time to explain anything to this brick

<ROM> Why does this guy think that Open source is more vulnerable to this than

closed source??????

<papercut> An $80k intellect

<Statman> Well said

<cmcnabb> Why do peole invest in M$, a convicted Monopolist, which as

misappropriated lots of code?

<LinuxItch> it can happen with proprietary code as well if i'm coding for

another company. that's bullshit

Galik/#linuxshow hands another asparine to eric

<Eggplant> because SCO is tossing around a frivolous suit, we should all run

around and scream and shout until it goes away???

<nyet> ROM: my point exactly

<Musashi> the ONLY reason it doesn't with colosed source is because you can't

SEE it

<pablo7> ken "i can only speak for the dollars inside my pocket" brown

<nyet> ROM: i've worked in several closed source shops. we stole stuff daily

<papercut> Someone's going to blow. I hear heavy breathing..

<jeffgus> what company can?

<Musashi> lol

<peragrin> Volunteers force real jobs out -- Ken I want money brown

<Eggplant> pablo: keyboard

<NZheretic> SCO-IBM Vs Timeline Inc-Microsoft : Better off with Linux

<roblimo> papercut, probably me... on speakerphone

<ROM> nyet: RIGHT and closed source gets to hide it!

<peragrin> MS doesn't indemify

<stock> LIBEL : To defame, or expose to public hatred, contempt, or ridicule,

by a writing, picture, sign, etc.; to lampoon.

<ROM> oh here we go now.... indemnification

<peragrin> SCO doens't idemify


<ROM> Darl's darling idea

<nyet> ROM: yup. i was even specifically told to do it and remove comments

<papercut> roblimo: All adds to the atmosphere ;-)

<Eggplant> indemnification is the magic word. it makes it all better

<Quietlife> redhat ?

<peragrin> Sun Doesn't Indemify

<nyet> ROM: and attribution

<Eggplant> so?

<Eggplant> they DON'T NEED TO

<LinuxItch> That doesn't prove not being guilty - that proves you won't be

held liable.

<Ranger> MS doesn't indemnify either..

<cmcnabb> Indeminfication is a red herring that means nothing.

<jdr> HP indemnifies.

<NZheretic> In February 13, 2004, Timeline And Cognos ( who were using

Microsoft's SQL ) Settled the "Patent Dispute" [] at a

cost to Cognos totaling $1.75 million and license certain of its


<jose> Neither is MS. Only for the price of the software.

<nyet> ROM: and in some cases move code around, not for functional reasons,

but to hide the fact we stole it

<mmccune> indemnification? MS sells software without warranty.

<LinuxItch> Microsoft doesn't indemnify their customers either.

<Eggplant> who put the stolen IP in the code? the customer? the end-user?



<Curt-> He's never read Microsoft's End User License Agreement.


<Galik> no one give indemnification .. not really

<ROM> nyet: exactly what SCO has kept saying but won't prove

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<jeffgus> why should the user get sued?

<stock> mmccune <==== Listen to this guy, he just said it

<LinuxItch> Curt-: no does

<NZheretic> Updated Timeline threat to Microsoft customers

<Statman> After this idiot, why not let Ballmer come on next week? Dear Lord

this idiot needs to be beaten with a great big club bat.

<Eggplant> ms says $5 or less

<bob> Funny I dont see indemnification in MS EULAs

<cmcnabb> Get him, ESR!

<roblimo> Eric, stop arguing with him. Pointless.

<nyet> ROM: well it depends on the fact we never showed any source to anybody

<papercut> Get rich quick! Lose weight! Enlarge your penis! Vote Ken Brown!

<ROM> obfuscation misappriation etc etc but Linux can't hide it because

everyone gets to see it

<Quietlife> RedHat has also posted a one million dollar donation to a fund for

the defense of open source developers against copyright

infringement suits and invited other companies to follow suit.

<Quietlife> [ Source

<LinuxItch> get him ESR!!!!!!!!!!!

<nyet> pretty muh

<Statman> There is indemnification in MS EULA's - for Microsoft

<Curt-> ESR has had his turn, time for someone else.

<nyet> dead on

mwg/#linuxshow cooks an egg on his speakers...

USSROVER/#linuxshow wishes call-in number was available >:)

<Galik> YES

<peragrin> Statman: LOLOL

<nyet> very true

<Ranger> Ken, you just lost.. Badly..

<NigelS> my headphones are fused to my head!

<Eggplant> can I sue MS because they left holes that could be exploited

security holes and damaged my business as a result?

<TomWitt> I really wish that WAS all he had to say

<ROM> Folks beat up on you cause you are full of #$%^

<Galik> errrr-ic errrr-ic

<nyet> Get a pass?

<papercut> Get rob back on to grill him

<jeffgus> maybe all companies should have their code audited!

<jeffgus> :)

<asaone> ken is selling a lot of shit

<stock> Arne next time give Ken a low pitch mike

<jeffgus> REDIRECT!

<prl> Woah, just noticed the racism warning. Folks - "potting the black" is a

pool/snooker reference about winning the game, and NOT intended as

pejorative reference to KB. My tactless mistake. Potting the Brown

might be better.

<Galik> errrr-ic errrr-ic

<pablo7> ken "this is all to complicated for me now" brown

<init2null> no, we don't know what. everything out of his mouth is a new silly


<NigelS> or a gag

<ROM> But he won't listen


<jeffgus> IT'S TOO HARD! ahahahah

<Statman> Bullshit

<Curt-> Yes, Rob is calmer and more subtle.

<NZheretic> We beat on Ken Brown because Ken Brown, misquotes and lies.

<linuxlobbyist> It's complicated for simple minds like Mr. Brown's

<nyet> yea

<JZA> "not true" can be tricky in Washington

<Ranger> You have received LOTS..

<nyet> stfu ESR

<nyet> dont bring ESR back

<JZA> "not true" can be tricky in Washington DC

<nyet> let rob do this alone next time


<Eggplant> he's misrepresented lots of stuff

<nyet> with a moderator

<Galik> Can you ask eric to shout a bit louder at Ken please?

<pablo7> ooh...

<linuxlobbyist> JZE: 'IS' can be tricky in washington

stock dials 0800-JERRYSPRINGER

<JZA> :)

<linuxlobbyist> JZA that is

<Eggplant> throw a chair!@

<jose> I bet he wrote for the Star. He is on the show so he can get quote and

use them out of content

<Arne> ...slip slidin' away... slip slidin' away...

<roblimo> papercut, let me get this book ms, finished, I'll do a one-on-one

with Ken. I will *not* give him a Slashdot interview platform

<LinuxItch> as kelso would say..


<prl> Hmmm. Calm down Eric?

<nyet> jovial

<nyet> metaphorically

<nyet> he was being an observer

<NigelS> someone should dry him with a towel


<papercut> roblimo: Cool

<asaone> ha what, what did I say, come on, come on

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[bdbdbdb That's all Folks!]

<peragrin> ROFL Stock

<Galik> errrr-ic errrr-ic

<mmccune> I think he is afraid of Eric!

<jdr> Ken Brown has the spine of a jellyfish.

<nyet> ken its his job

<ROM> He's "open" but he won't listen to anything

<Ranger> Slip sliding away..

<asaone> how in the hell do you talk to this guy

<jose> How come he didn't speak with Linus?

<USSROVER> Hosts tell "guest" why should I buy M$ (or other) "software"

when free software out there (open source or other wise)

<Kent> Boy is this guy a LIER!

<Galik> Anyone should be scared of eric. i would be

<papercut> jdr: Hey, deep sea creatures!

<Quietlife> and has admited he's wrong once - lets try for twice !!

<peragrin> You don't understand anything Ken

<TomWitt> ... I knew it wasn't ALL he had to say... unfortunately

<nyet> u cant he's paid to be an "observer" and give "metaphorical" opinions

<NigelS> no but it means you're wrong

<pablo7> apology accempted admiral nyet -- Darth Vader.

<linuxlobbyist> He's "open" alright. Like a sieve

<peragrin> Try kindergarden First Ken sharing is first learned there

<Eggplant> paid shill

<ROM> Yes

<nyet> lol pablo

<prl> PLEASE ask him about AST and Toptygin and the rest.

<Ranger> Vague "references".

<MacBeach> man, this is going to be a valuable MP3 to keep around.


<jdr> Ken is simply trying to create confusion.

SignOff fred: #linuxshow (Quit: Leaving)

<papercut> Go rob!

<Curt-> Yes, the principles disagree with his conclusions, and his quotes, and

his stated "facts". Lots of people disagree.

<Arne> This is an amazing TLS...

<papercut> I vote for that

Eggplant/#linuxshow throws a chair

mwg/#linuxshow puts lead shielding around his speakers to block the gamma


<ROM> MacBeach: about as funny as Mr Bergis

<roblimo> stock, just about

<nyet> great stuff

<Eggplant> it was fun

<nyet> stellar

<LinuxItch> this is the best TLS ever

<linuxlobbyist> We love you because this is entertaining

<USSROVER> does this guy have a computer even ??? what OS & programs on it

<stock> :)

<NigelS> I second the vote! most amazing TLS ever

<Eggplant> cool

<papercut> Fantastic show

<LinuxItch> i can't wait to listen to this again.

<nyet> yes yes yes

<papercut> I love roblimo

<JZA> I think i twas more than 2 minutes

<JZA> :)

<Galik> W00t.

<NigelS> all those in favour /me Aye!

<nyet> more rob, less esr

<Ranger> Excellent show..

<LinuxItch> Absolutely marvelous show

<Eggplant> roblimo can have my children

NigelS/#linuxshow Aye!

<bob> Ask him who is the largest contributor to Ad%$@^$#^#NO CONNECTION

<GEORGE> was fun

<LinuxItch> get him and mcbride on together.

<JZA> it was great

<peragrin> It was fun listening to you get your arse kicked around, by people

with double digit IQ's and higher

<papercut> A one man SCO!

<Curt-> I am very glad I had a chance to be here for this, not just listening

to the mp3. Thanks, guys.

<LinuxItch> JeffGerhardt: make sure your pbx is up for call-ins

<ROM> We so need Darl on this show

<ROM> with his sniper bodygaurd

<Eggplant> f darl

<mmccune> Have Roblimo moderate it. ESR sounded like he wanted to shoot Ken!

<nyet> eheh

<papercut> roblimo for president!

<Curt-> HIS HANDSET DIED! Hardware failure.

<nyet> oh fuck

<nyet> hahaha

<nyet> pownt

<linuxlobbyist> This guy is so f***ed. AdTI is f***ed.

<ROM> and his handgun to protect him from the linux "zealots"

<roblimo> papercut, I already have a job I like, thanks.

[LinuxItch ] [linuxlobbyist ] [ ] [ ]

<Eggplant> walk into a room fulla linxu zealots armed with a nuke

<Arne> ROM - We hope not.

<stock> linuxlobbyist hey this man hit the Wallstreet paper

<papercut> roblimo: Heh, I'm in the UK anyway!

Kelledin [] has joined


<p0z3r> What's this guy smoking?

<Galik> I hope Ken walks away from this with a hint of a clue you know.

<pablo7> ken "i wanna write for the NY times" brown

<nyet> lets package rob into little care packages with parachutes and drop

them on ken's house

Eggplant/#linuxshow sends Ken a nice fat spliff

<Ranger> He talks to them, but he doesn't listen.. Andy says this in spades!!!

<mmccune> I can here RobLimo say: I did not use "that software"

<asaone> Ken and think just don't should good together

<NZheretic> I hear Gerbols was a nice guy too.

<papercut> lol

<Galik> what a great show :)

<Eggplant> peace dude

<pablo7> not just talk, listen.

<mwg> GIven the temterature of the proceedings, I'm amazed that he is willing

to talk again.

<papercut> Gerbils??

<LinuxItch> phenomenal show!!!

<Eggplant> fun show

<Kelledin> heh. well, at least Ken got a good schooling

<MacBeach> lively would be the better word.

<asaone> best show

<JZA> wow great stuff

<Quietlife> he *already knows* he's wrong - the [ay[aket was just tooo large

to say no to

<LinuxItch> oh, nice

<Eggplant> damn small

<JZA> I can get used to this show schedule

<init2null> we got him. "anytime."

<papercut> Great show. Not enough blood but still cool

<Kelledin> he needed that very much, even if he's too dull to listen

<JZA> :)

<asaone> lost the feed

<roblimo> Doing this is Ken's job.

<mmccune> How soon until archives. I want to listen to this one again!

<ROM> nice closing music

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<Quietlife> me 2

<Eggplant> peace man

<nyet> good show guys

<bob> Thats dam white of you Ken

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<pablo7> why doesn't mainstream media call people on their BS like that?

<ric> 104

<init2null> i hope pj writes an article on this.

<Curt-> Rob, agreed. He has to do it in order to get more paying customers in

the future.

<mwg> mmccune: Just wait a few minutes, the feed will re-run.

<Eggplant> bob

<Statman> 'til next week all

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<stock> Woho G.R.E.A.T show!

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<nyet> outstanding

<prl> Right, me off to bed.

<prl> Night all

<Kelledin> ditto, i want the mp3!

<LinuxItch> what a show!! I have a splitting headache though.

<nyet> nite

<asaone> what a great show guys

<Eggplant> okay, peace peeps

<peragrin> Good night all, glad I made it back for most of it.

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<Kelledin> i had to miss part of the reaming for dinner :(

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<LinuxItch> good night all - see ya next week.

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<papercut> There's not enough journo's like roblimo

<init2null> i just regret that idiotic opinion has to be rebutted.

<mmap> ah, missed it

<jdr> I can't wait to see a transcript of this show, with commentary!

<mmccune> mwg: I want to put it on my MP3 player for tomorrow.

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<Curt-> Pablo, because mainstream media is bought and paid for by the same


<Eggplant> mwg: if yer ever up in warren, call me, check registry

for number

<LinuxItch> exit

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--------------- -- -

| plunk ( (Internic Network)

ircname : Sorry, I don't have a real name.

| channels : #linuxshow

server : (The LINUX(R)Show!![tm])

: idle : 0 hours 30 mins 13 secs (signon: Wed Jul 14 02:58:24 2004)

<boneski> paid or complete moron?

<terracon> wow glad I tuned in. I was late but there was some great stuff

<Voyager> pablo7:because that how they make there money too.

<Eggplant> buy ya a beer, even

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#linuxshow [Leaving]

<linuxlobbyist> thanks for the great show

<MacBeach> There is an option in XMMS to save a copy of the MP3

<mmap> can anyone sum up what brown said tonight on TLS ?

<linuxlobbyist> time for me to go

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after coming in contact with so much BS.]

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#linuxshow [Later]

<mmap> anything different?

<nyet> mmap: "im a paid gun"

<Arne> jdr - are you volunteering to make the transcript...

<Eggplant> mmap: ><

<NZheretic> MacBeach : yes

<mwg> mmccune: If you have a good sound card and ALSA, capture the analog mix

with a recording program.

<asaone> thank god for the linux show and the people who stand up to this bull


<Curt-> mmap, just listen to the mp3. It's worth it.

[msg(plunk)] you already glanced at that USS-Hartford.pdf ?

<Galik> Yeah. That was well worth screwing up my sleeping patterns for

<boneski> mmap, PARRRPP

<USSROVER> JeffGerhardt PM

<mmap> heh

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<papercut> Eric's shouting was kindly sponsored by the OSI. Thank you

<jdr> Arne, I wish I had time. Unfortunately I'm swamped at the moment.

[plunk(] I took a short look at it. It seems

to be the correct article.

SignOff terracon: #linuxshow (Quit: best linux show ... ever)

<Quietlife> TYVM guys - cant wait for the return of the ken *after* he's been

forced to eat humble pie :-)

<mmap> Curt- : I admit, I'm lazy, I like summaries ;-)

[msg(plunk)] oh good.. got it from google cache

<MacBeach> I bet everyone brings a megaphone to the next debate.

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<Galik> Ken Bron Summery: I don't have a clue but I like to listen to you

guys. And I also like to dissagree

<init2null> we do need a transcript. that's the only way to nail him.

<papercut> Damn I'm hours behind now. Worth it though

<mmccune> mwg: Does it save it MP3? Last time I tried to save the show it made

a huge .WAV file.

<mmap> Eric: .. ESR was on the show, okay, maybe I should listen, that has to

be good..

Eggplant/#linuxshow wishes he had a decent foot pedal.... would do the

transcript in a heartbeat

<mwg> Eggplant: I'm not sure what you meant about, but I've

written it down to figure out later.

<Eggplant> do a whois lookup on it

<boneski> papercut, good enough to forget about giant monster fish

<Eggplant> call if yer around warren, I'll buy you beer

[plunk(] I don't know if it's an exact copy

of the original, though. If it's important, try to read it on The

Day's site.

<Eggplant> easy, huh?

<init2null> maybe we should write the people that transcribe teleconferences

for pj.

<papercut> boneski: Hey, we almost did, yeah!

<boneski> Tanenbaum was spot on with that prick

<papercut> yup


[msg(plunk)] ok.

<nyet> is that the link for the mp3 of this show?

<jdr> boneski, Not kidding!

<mwg> mmccune: Most things will, use LAME to boil it down to an MP3 afterwards

, or use Audacity and export to MP3, but the uncompressed sound is

still recorded until you close the session.

<mmap> woah, andy was on the show?

<boneski> Can we get brown and torvalds on?

<NZheretic> Galik : Ken Brown Summery: " Screw you guys, I'm going home."

<nyet> brown torvalds and rob as moderator

<nyet> less others next time

<Galik> lol

<Curt-> mmap, ok. Brown said that he's attacking OSS because there is no

attribution, no indemnification, and because the software is given

away society "loses" what would otherwise have value.

<papercut> Brown bossed the show for a while though (more through bullying


<nyet> i think brown would be better 1v1

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<jdr> Ken Brown Summary: I agree with everything you say, but you're all full

of shit!

<nyet> he'd get less defensive

<jose> I think the next debate with him should be in writing on Newsforge. He

was given way too much ammo tonight. Expect a lot of what was said

here to be misquoted over the next few days. Right off the bat, the

comments by ESR on using ideas will come back as the Linux community

agrees that it is OK to steal IP.

<Curt-> ESR bullied right back.

<mwg> Eggplant: I just am not clear on how I can find you from that site, but

I'll figure it out. I'm up that way regularly visiting my friend in

Roseville. I was out there today for a bit, actually.

<asaone> one for the books guys

<mmccune> mwg: That is what I thought. I use something similar to listen to

live feeds to conver them to MP3 or OGG.

<NZheretic> The problem is that the Microsoft inspired Wintrolls know that mud


<JeffGerhardt> ok if that wasnt worth a few bucks in the tip jar

<jdr> ESR lost his cool.

<BKP> Outta here. Must eat junk food...

<JeffGerhardt> yes eric popped a cork

<papercut> Guys like this will always win in 'real time'. He's a politician

SignOff BKP: #linuxshow (Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.52B [Mozilla


<asaone> yes

<nyet> lies always win in realtime

<MacBeach> You have to give him credit for hanging in there after being so

outnumbered though (he's still hopelessly wrong).

<papercut> Great show Jeff, even without the fish

<JeffGerhardt> hey we need about 500 people to go register domains

<NZheretic> Microosft will keep lieing because the honest truth is


<asaone> doing another 50 tonight

<ric> that was classic

<Curt-> papercut, agreed! He talked just like a studied politician.

<Eggplant> mwg: again, whois and you'll get it

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<JeffGerhardt> we need about 500 bucks more for LinuxWorld

<papercut> Curt-: Yep

SignOff GEORGE: #linuxshow ()

<NZheretic> The AutoZone Hearing - AutoZone Wins a Stay!

<JeffGerhardt> if anyone in theLA area is going

<ric> ill do 200


<JeffGerhardt> Arne is looking for a ride

<Curt-> papercut, that's why Libertarians don't win elections, they're not the

types to sling crap so smoothly.

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<nyet> i just popped u guys $20

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<nyet> not much but its worth it

<papercut> Curt-: Yep

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<Eggplant> okay, my wine cooler is empty. peace peeps

<JeffGerhardt> go to and click on the paypal link

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<papercut> peace

<mwg> Eggplant: ABout what I just figured out when I looked up and saw you'd

said to do that. Oh, foo, he just left...

<JeffGerhardt> we need helpers

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<JeffGerhardt> anyone here from BALUG

<Curt-> Indeed, bed time. Thanks, all, for the sling-fest.

<init2null> nyet, those lies were so weak, i cen't see it getting believers

with subliminal messages. :)

<mwg> Repeat run on now...

<JeffGerhardt> we need the word to get out to the BALUG list

<papercut> Bye Curt

<MacBeach> Oh boy the show is starting again!

SignOff Curt-: #linuxshow (Quit: Peace, may your aim never waver.)

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<asaone> just did another $50.00 from paypal

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<d-b> Is the show over??

mmap/#linuxshow yawns

plunk [] has left #linuxshow ["You run,

never stop, got to win, got to run till you drop"]

<mmap> i need another beer

<papercut> mmap: good idea

<mmap> if i'm going to listen to that mp3 at least

<mwg> Gotta go, laundry time.

<nyet> nite guys, great show

<MacBeach> yep, it just restarted.

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<papercut> Bye mwg

<d-b> ah

mmap/#linuxshow sips some homebrew doppelbock that he brewed

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<asaone> you all have a great night, and please remember the troops still out


<ric> how much do you need?

<init2null> bye everyone

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papercut/#linuxshow no longer needs to remove wax from his ears

NigelS/#linuxshow slowly closes his jaw

<mmap> there's troops out there?

<JeffGerhardt> wow everyone is leaving fast

mmap/#linuxshow peeks menacingly outside his house

<papercut> Hey, come back!

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[JeffGerhardt ] [jeffgus ] [ ] [ ]

<MacBeach> This show wore everyone out Jeff.

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[JeffGerhardt ] [jeffgus ] [ ] [ ]

<NigelS> it's 04:28 here :)

[JeffGerhardt ] [jeffgus ] [ ] [ ]

<ric> yeah

<ric> i know

<mmap> crimeney, where do you live, alaska?

<JeffGerhardt> nigel UK??

<papercut> 04:26 here. I must be slow

<stock> JeffGerhardt yeah... its been a looong show..

<mmap> oh wait, that's an earlier time, nM

<NigelS> JeffGerhardt: yep

<ric> yep

[JeffGerhardt ] [jeffgus ] [ ] [ ]

[JeffGerhardt ] [jeffgus ] [ ] [ ]

<Kent> JeffGerhardt: I think everyones a little exhausted. :-)

<JeffGerhardt> ric did you ask me a question?

<papercut> Buxton, Derbyshire

<papercut> Er, UK

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<jose> Ken pissed everyone off, so everyone is leaving to smack their wives. I

expect there will be a lot of dickless men in the morning...

<ric> how much do you need?

<NigelS> I'm in Leicestershire

<papercut> jose: ouch

<mmap> darl is at home, smacking his wives (he lives in utah, right?)

<MacBeach> hehe

<papercut> NigelS: Leicestershire eh?

<papercut> A bugger to spell

<stock> JeffGerhardt but basicly... if this Ken "the man" is the President of

the Alexis de Tocqueville Institution , i think we all smell a Pony

<NigelS> hehe, on the Warwickshire/Leicestershire border to be exact

<boneski> papercut, not much point you going to bed

<mmap> i think i know what they've been doing at the "toke"-ville institute

<papercut> NigelS: Ah..

<papercut> boneski: Alas you're right.

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<jose> mmap> you got it!

<boneski> stock, a Pony is UK slang for 25 pounds stirling

<JeffGerhardt> I think what you smell

<JeffGerhardt> is the stench of DC politics

<MacBeach> Eric was doing all that yelling at a restaurant? WoW

<stock> boneski sorry.. i ment, i simply cannot believe this man is the

President of the Alexis de Tocqueville Institution.

<NigelS> heh, I think it's great, people like that are very frustrating

<jose> MacBeach: you are right! i forgot he was out.

<mmap> he's also the president of the hair club for men

<papercut> Anyone hear gunfire during the show?

<JeffGerhardt> can you imagine the people in the restaurant

<boneski> I bet they were pissing themselves

<NigelS> stock: you say that as though some made up "institution" is an

impressive thing

<MacBeach> I bet ADTI is an 8A company here in DC...he's probably the whole


<boneski> or wanted to strangle brown too

stock wonders if he had enough intellectual luggage to come with that name

<mmap> brown describes him perfectly if he ever meets ESR, especially while

eric is carrying weaponry

<JeffGerhardt> ADTI recently lost their corporate standing.

<JeffGerhardt> But that happens all the time

<papercut> I should think the irc log for tonight will be worth reading

<Severian> MacBeach, It is no Brookings Institution, but it is bigger than


<boneski> brown will probably say how he corrected everyone

<JeffGerhardt> lots of companies only file state papers every other year

[JeffGerhardt ] [jeffgus ] [ ] [ ]

[JeffGerhardt ] [jeffgus ] [ ] [ ]

<mmap> most companies file papers, adti smokes theirs

<NigelS> JeffGerhardt: I really can't! we should google for press reports of a

man being detained in a restaurant for disorderly behaviour :)

<boneski> stock, there's also pony and trap for crap

<MacBeach> HAHA

<mmap> i'm having fun



<mmap> meh


<NZheretic> Number: C1192057 Date Filed: 6/26/1986 Status: suspended

<NigelS> If there is a Rev OS 2 I hope this show gets a mention :)

<NigelS> they could play sections from the show with the IRC log scrolling in

the background in funky fonts

<stock> JeffGerhardt ok here's a good tip : leach and download all papers for

download at microsoft, which mention the Alexis de Tocqueville

Institution .... i wouldn;t be surprised , if it keeps moving along

like this, M$ will remove these

<boneski> he called us librals didn't he

<Severian> NZ, I believ they moved to the DC area. They could be registered

in any state nearby. They did start in California.

<JZA> boneski, but I though I was a commi

<JZA> :)

<mmap> you download mp3s?

<mmap> just kidding..

<NigelS> incidentally the particular use of liberal which you have in the US

seems to be quite different from the UK interpretation

<papercut> Hmm, Tocqueville doesn't seem to keen on the States: "Yet in his

seminal work Democracy in America, Alexis de Tocqueville says, ?I

do not know any country where, in general, less independence of

mind and genuine freedom of discussion reign than in America.?

<NigelS> a liberal here can mean someone who's quite right wing


<jose> He really didn't know much about anything. His points were very weak.

Darl sounds like a genius compared to Ken

<MacBeach> We call that "classical Liberal" here

<boneski> but has zero chance of power

<NZheretic> Question, if the Alexis de Tocqueville Institution is currently

suspended as a corporation, then you would not have to worry about

pearcing the corporate veil? You can sue the Ken Brown directly

for things such as slander and cyberslander!

<boneski> still, at lest we're his "bothers"

<NigelS> his argument about the people being pressured into using the GP was


<NigelS> GPL*

<papercut> lol


<papercut> Yo' bro'

<stock> boneski try to find out if Ken uses gnucash to balance his paychecks


<NigelS> from no where he pulls this concept of "peer-pressure" in the FLOSS


<boneski> should have asked how's his julie

<papercut> lol

<NigelS> lol

<boneski> so who's subscribes his address to pr0n spam lists?

<Musashi> gnite to all may the penguin be with you

<papercut> Parts of the show were like something off the Fast Show or Big

Train tonight

<papercut> bye

<Galik> I wonder if Ken Brown will quote this 'interview' in one of his up and

coming reports...

<NigelS> dey wudn't be gettin' no respc' if dey ain't usin' da GPL, yeah bro'?

<papercut> lol

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<stock> lol

<JZA> papercut, you mean I can be black and dont get prejudge?

<JZA> wow

<boneski> probably drives a old beemer with blacked out windas

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<boneski> need a shower now. see ya'll next time

<Galik> and a tommy gun...

<NigelS> bye bye

<papercut> bye boneski

<MacBeach> I'm off too. Everyone have a great week!

<jose> I wish this show was on video. Would have loved to see ESR and Ken live

on the same set

<boneski> later peeps

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<stock> yeah, its le quartroze juilllet today : French Liberation Day

<Kent> everybody must be downloading the archive of this show. Only 4.3kB/sec

Voyager [] has left #linuxshow

[Elvis has left the building....]

<papercut> Hi Kent

<Kent> Hi papercut!

<papercut> Quite a show

<mmap> actually, the question on my mind is why ken brown bothered to be

interviewed: it doesn't seem like he had much to gain from it, only

those that would listen would be those that are against him, odd.

stock is outta here too

<papercut> bye stock

<Kent> later stock

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#linuxshow []

<jose> I couldn't take hearing the show again. I would get mad, do something

stupid and wake up dickless in the morning.

<stock> have a nice day and week... cool show, tille next week :)

Signon time : Wed Jul 14 02:58:55 2004

Signoff time : Wed Jul 14 05:42:12 2004

Total uptime : 0d 2h 43m 17s

SignOff: stock ([BX] Reserve your copy of BitchX-75p3 for the Nintendo

Gameboy today!)

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